Advice Please: Personal Trainers at the Gym

Ok, I joined Gold's Gym and need advice on the whole personal trainer thing & etiquette, etc. I have a couple of questions & hope someone can help.

They had paired me up with this guy & I was hoping to get paired up with a female & nicely asked about that & was told it does not matter (yes, technically it may not matter, but I would have been more comfortable). So, I decided to suck it up & work with this guy as I got 3 sessions for free. I really felt like he was condescending & a bit impatient. I also felt that he was throwing me a sales pitch to buy future sessions with him (I am on a limited budget & even if I had the extra money I wouldn't want to with him). How do I deal with this? I do not want to do a free 3rd session with him & if they will allow it--would rather do the 3rd free session with someone else.

My other question is this: They have a circuit weight training area with machines. I would love to incorporate these into my workout & do weight training, but am unclear as to what I am supposed to do (the first 2 sessions with the trainer never showed me any of these--he only did the ball, handweights on the ball, etc.). I don't want to injure myself using a machine incorrectly so are they supposed to show me briefly how to use it? I just feel when I walk in there that I am on my own. Am I supposed to pay for personal training sessions to learn the machines there?

Thanks much!

Cindy

I would talk to the manager. Explain your situation and be very polite. When you meet with the new trainer say that you want to learn how to use the circuit machines.  Most trainers are happy to help, but not all of them

Amy

 

That really sucks, even if you're getting the sessions for free, you still paid for a gym membership and they should honor your requests.  Check and see if they do machine orientation.  At my club, they won't even let a new member work out until they have gone through one.  They would be the ones to get sued if you hurt yourself.   Good Job on your decision to reclaim your health.  Don't get discouraged and stand your ground!  You deserve it.  Good Luck

Having a trainer that you're comfortable with makes all the difference. It's your perogative to switch to someone different if you don't like the current one. Talk to the fitness manager and let him know you and whatshisname just aren't a good fit, and you'd like to workout with someone else, a female if you prefer. Also, the mark of a good trainer is that they listen to what your goals are and take those into account. If you only have a few sessions available to  you, make it clear that your primary goal for these sessions is that you want to learn how to use the machines safely and effectively.

Good luck! I know the gym and trainer game can be frustrating. Especially when you feel like no one is listening to you.

I agree with Betzc!  The membership is to benefit you, and the gym should be doing everything they can to help you.  Voice your concerns to a manager.  I have a membership at the Rush, and I have the same feelings about many of their personal trainers: impatient, not involved or interested, etc.

As for learning to use the machines, you certainly should not have to pay for a personal trainer to show you that.  The gym staff should be able and willing to do so.  However, always read the instructions on the machine, since I've found that a lot of non-managers at gyms have NO IDEA what they're talking about.

I'm a member at Bally's and use one of their trainers. He just happened to be walking by when I was signing up and so I ended up using him. I did find out later though that they have a personal training manager who usually assigns clients to trainers so you might see if your gym has one of those. You could explain that you'd like to try your last session with a female. Originally that was what I had been hoping for too but I am very happy with my male trainer. You could also go into the gym on a non-session day and see if you see a female trainer and talk to her about it. I did that for a friend who didn't want to use my trainer so I talked to one I'd see around. Believe me they are more than happy to discuss working with you. Keep in mind though that they do work on commission so they will try to sell you but a good trainer will understand if you say it's not financially feasible. It's expensive, I know! But definitely worth it - my arms are starting to have definition :)

As for machines, I never got a lesson on them either. There are instructions on the sides of the ones at my gym so I usually look at that first. But you should be able to ask the front desk to have someone show you them and they'd help you out. Don't be shy about it, much better to take a few minutes to learn the proper way to do things then end up getting injured.

Good luck!

Thank you everyone for your help & advice.  I wanted to get a feel for what is the norm, etc. I will definitely be speaking with someone in charge at the gym so I can use my 3rd free session with a different trainer. I'll get through the awkwardness if the other trainer guy approaches me. And besides, one day I would love to pay for a few sessions. Since it is an investment,  you need to be able to get a feel for other peoples approach, right?! I'll also ask at the same time about the machines & whom to go to. And, if I'm not satisfied I'll cancel my membership & go elsewhere as a couple of small ones just opened up & they aren't a chain.

Thanks again!

Cindy

The trainer is suppose to work for you, so you can tell him what you want to do. they are performing a service for you, not the other way around.

And when you go in for your final session, ask to be shown free-weights training. Machine training is only marginally useful in a rehabilitation setting as part of a physical therapy program - free weights are superior in terms of results achieved.

 There is a place for machines in most training programs - as a coat rack while you're over in the free weights area lifting.

 If your trainer was at all competent, he wouldn't have you playing around with assistance exercises on a swiss ball, he'd have been showing you the basic program with a barbell.

 When you approach the manager, ask to have someone who can show you the basics of barbell training - machines have no place in a starter workout.

Original Post by melkor:

And when you go in for your final session, ask to be shown free-weights training. Machine training is only marginally useful in a rehabilitation setting as part of a physical therapy program - free weights are superior in terms of results achieved.

 There is a place for machines in most training programs - as a coat rack while you're over in the free weights area lifting.

 If your trainer was at all competent, he wouldn't have you playing around with assistance exercises on a swiss ball, he'd have been showing you the basic program with a barbell.

 When you approach the manager, ask to have someone who can show you the basics of barbell training - machines have no place in a starter workout.

 melkor, I sure wish I had more info & knew more of what to ask, etc, before working with this trainer guy! I would be interested in the barbell training/free weights. (funny comment about the machines as a coatrack! lol) Would starting out on a couple of machines be so bad while learning some free weight exercises???

Speaking from experience (a couple years ago, I had a trainer at the Y show me some things to do, and she showed me both free and machines) - if you start on the machines, you will forget what you learned about free weights, and you'll never get back to them.

Machines aren't easier for a beginner, they just give you the appearance of keeping you safer. You can start as light as you need on the free weights, so that you get used to the movements and how it feels to hold them, but I strongly recommend not bothering with the machines for the majority of exercises.

I do think the cable machines are fine (there are a bunch of things you can do with the cable, where you adjust what height it is at, and what kind of handle it has).  And it is possible you will find that a certain exercise hurts you - for instance, I can't do bent over rows and lat pullovers with dumbbells - I end up hurting my back. So I've been doing cable rows and lat pulldowns.

Im also a member at a golds gym. Just ask one of the employees to show you around the machines, its there job!

Original Post by curepsp:

Im also a member at a golds gym. Just ask one of the employees to show you around the machines, its there job!

 Thank you curepsp. I'm sure each location is a bit different, but at mine they tend to have young kids working behind the counter & I would have never known this was in their job description! lol

i go to bally's and i've been HARRASSED by this one trainer for about 2 weeks- so much so i somedays avoid the gym and do the WII or go for a bikeride so i don't have to deal with her! She asked if i'd like a free session- i'm not one for these trainers- no offense- but if i were going to go to one, i'd choose one that is well reccommended, and may i say, FIT themselves. So i accepted the free session, but in hindsight said, forget it, and stayed at work late that day instead. She CONTINUALLY finds me at the gym and talks to me for the entire cardio portion, annoying me, i like to do my sudoku on the bike lol! Yesterday i walk in, and i'm talking to a family member that's walking out, and she's in my face! I barely said anything to her and she then was like, "what's wrong, what's wrong, are you ok, are you ok, what happened!" i was like.. SERIOUSLY? ...........sorry rant.

Original Post by melkor:

And when you go in for your final session, ask to be shown free-weights training. Machine training is only marginally useful in a rehabilitation setting as part of a physical therapy program - free weights are superior in terms of results achieved.

 There is a place for machines in most training programs - as a coat rack while you're over in the free weights area lifting.

 If your trainer was at all competent, he wouldn't have you playing around with assistance exercises on a swiss ball, he'd have been showing you the basic program with a barbell.

 When you approach the manager, ask to have someone who can show you the basics of barbell training - machines have no place in a starter workout.

I would agree that free weights are desired for best results within a workout but consideration has to be taken for someone's safety and comfort level with the exercises performed. 

I actually prefer to use weight machines for the first week or two in programs for people with little to no experience with resistance training.  It helps to isolate and stimulate the major muscle groups first and reduces some of the initial soreness that can come from diving into a free weight program right off the bat.  Too many of my clients have been to other trainers that throw them to the wolves right off the start, making it nearly impossible to even get out of bed the next day.  I like to start them off with exercises they will be comfortable with but still challenge them.  The machines allow me to emphasize what muscle group they should be focusing on contracting so that it can be carried into further training. 

Every client will be different though.  There will be exceptions based on health history, experience, age, goals, etc.  As fitness professionals we need to be able to create programs for EVERY person individually, not based off of what works best for some. 

To say that machines have no use in a starter program is just an uneducated thing to say.  Take into consideration that many of the people that read these forums are not in the condition that you or I may be in.  As the forum moderator people read your posts and will listen to what you say.  If you send a completely inexperienced person out to a barbell weight program with no supervision there is a significant increase in risk for injury for them or the people around them.  I've seen grown men get under a bench and slap on 45 lb plates just cause the guy next to him did and nearly choke themselves. 

To the OP.  Most gyms have the machines set up so that you can easily transition from one muscle group to the next without much research.  Take advantage of that.  Get an employee to explain how to operate the machines.  The first 1-4 weeks your body will go through many neurological changes and machines are a great way of doing this with little risk of injury.  Once you have a good base and you are familiar with the movements you can easily transition to a free weight, band, or dumbbell workout.

On a side note, anyone looking for a trainer should find out their certification(s) and research them.  Find out what that person had to do to receive it.  Does it require a Bachelors?  Masters?  or can anyone with internet access get it?  This will tell you a lot about the competency of that trainer.  ACSM and NSCA tend to be the most recognized by professionals.

Sorry for the long post =).

Training on your own and training with a trainer is two different kettles of fish - when a trainer walks her through the workout I would assume competence on the trainer's part so you don't get any ego-induced accidents. The kind of ego training you're talking about shouldn't happen while she's being trained by someone, and it's just as likely to happen on machines as it is using free weights - I've done my share of yeling at people using weights they couldn't control, and more of that was done with machines than barbells.

But machines vs. free weights? No contest:

Following initial assessments, 30 sedentary male and female subjects were randomly divided among a nonexercise control group (C), a freeform group (FF) and a fixed-form (FX) group.
The FF group showed twice as much strength improvement as the FX group (115% vs. 57%, respectively). Study authors also found a 111% increase in joint pain among the FX group, whereas joint pain decreased by 30% in the FF group, with no new symptoms occurring upon study completion. Balance improved in both groups; however, the FF group had a 245% increase in balance capabilities compared with a less significant 49% increase among the FX group

Strength Gains: Fixed vs. Freeform Equipment
(Original study: Journal of Strength & Conditioning Research. 22(1):75-81, January 2008.

 It's a tradeoff you've got to make for yourself of course and can be relevant for a solo trainee - while machines tend to mean more pain and less gain than the equivalent free weights exercise, if it's a question of using machines or not doing it at all, use the machine.

 However, not when it's a case of what to have the trainer show her for the last session. And not on any other occasion either - if you're in a Nautilus gym where all they have is machines you have no choice, but when you do have, the choice, go with the one that allows you 3D freedom of motion - unless you like the prospect of increased joint pain and less strength gains from machine training.

 A little machine work for a 2 week working-in period? Sure, I can see that happen with a client with rehab needs, muscle imbalances, various joint impingements and so on, but not as a general rule. Clients who start out on machines lose coordination and actually need retraining to manage the transition to free weights, so using machines needlessly and in place of free weights inhibits their gains in both strength and motor skills - both according to the study I linked to, and according to Eric Cressey, Mike Boyle, Mike Robertson, Charles Staley, Charles Poliquin and Alwyn Cosgrove.

 Note that the cable station counts as a free weight in this context since it does allow 3D freedom of motion when using it. So if by "machines" you mean "The cable station", I can see the utility. And there are some circumstances where machine use is warranted, but that's mostly to do with injury rehab and various specialized training protocols

 NSCA and ISSA are currently duking it out for first place status, NASM or ISSA are also good certs, ACE trainers have wildly varying levels of quality, and club certified trainers might as well have gotten their certifications out of a ceral box.

I think you and I are misunderstanding each other.  I wasn't arguing that machines are better than free weights...free weight exercises have far more benefit in multiple aspects.  It develops better muscle recruitment, ROM, strength, etc. at any given workload compared directly to its counterpart.  Every study will show that.  My comment was that machines can not be regarded as worthless in a starter program.  I believe the OP wanted to learn the machines, which probably means that she would adhere to a program using machines better than one with free weights.  So in that case, I would definitely go for it.  If she decided to buy training from whomever the next trainer she uses then free weights are the way to go.   

As far as trainer's competency, you'd be surprised at how many don't understand how to adhere a program to the persons' needs.  Right now I have probably 15 people that I work with that have had horrible experiences with trainers in the past.  Personally, I witnessed a trainer in Denver force a 60+ year old, obese man, to do standing deep squats with no ball or support.  He was having him try to do these to a metronome at approximately 1 full repetition every 2 seconds.  After about 6 reps the man fell over and couldn't breathe.  I thought I was going to have to perform CPR on him but there was an M.D. on the treadmill that was there faster than myself.  I saw the same trainer trying to teach a 12 year old boy how to do plyometric jumps off of a box. I asked the trainer to step to the side and explained to him the problem with plyometric exercises and youth. 

Its unfortunate that clubs will employ people that are simply in good shape and sent in for an internet packet to be certified.  Before I graduated college I went to an interview for a 1 on 1 personal training company called Fitness Together where the boss told me that he'd get me certified in only 50 hours of instruction with him.  I walked out.  I spent 4 years in college to get a degree in Exercise Science and I'd already passed the NSCA, CSCS exam and I wasn't about to work along side people like that.

Yeah, I think we're mostly in agreement - and it's one of those old chestnuts that consistency trumps efficiency so the first order of the day is to establish a program that the client will actually adhere to and is capable of performing.

 I'd be entirely unsurprised, actually - there are far more "club-certified personal trainers" with a cereal-box certification than there are NSCA-certified strength and conditioning specialists out there. And the public rarely appreciates the difference between 4 years of college with extra certification on top and one weekend of instruction from the health club manager until they've experienced it for themselves - there is a vast gulf between getting "generic program #1" and having one designed for you by a specialist.

 Speaking of which - I think I remember Dr. Mohr saying something to the effect of "HIIT is great and all, but you have to think before you use it - I don't use HIIT with any of my clients, because I'm working with obese clients who you don't know if they can make it through 5 minutes of walking on the treadmill." That would be a great quote to tattoo on the forehead of some trainers using "generic workout #1" suited for a twentysomthing varsity rower on a 60-year old sedentary person getting started with his/her first workout in 40 years, neh?

Ya, I think we're on the same page now.

I definitely wouldn't use HIIT with hardly anyone I work with.  I have a few clients that have to sit down after only a lap or two of light walk around our small track (24 laps = 1 mi).  One of which makes the treadmill belt stop when he steps on it.

I had a client of mine ask me the other day what books I found my programs in, and it made me laugh a bit.  We had just finished our fourth week where I pretty much had him doing different exercises for each muscle group every week (2x wk frequency, split routine) to maximize initial recruitment.  I incorporated cables, bands, dumbells, machines, smith, and barbell.  He couldn't believe that I could have him do that many different things with what he thought was a very limited supply of equipment.  The last trainer he was with had him doing the same exercises at 8 weeks, that he did the first.

You had mentioned the ISSA certification and I had actually never heard of them.  From what I saw on their site, it looks like a good alternative.  I know ACE used to be a joke but it has since become much better.  My old professor used to call ACE certified trainers "towel folders," lol.  ACSM (American College of Sports Medicine) is actually considered the gold standard for our field.  In 2006 only 1,303 people in the country got their Certified Personal Trainer; 874 got the Health Fitness Instructor; and 146 got the Exercise Specialist.  The passing rate on the exam was 69%, 67%, and 52% respectively.  So if you see someone with ACSM, you know they know their stuff.

Sorry to the OP for derailing the topic...Have a good day!

melkor/jlk thank you.  Between reading your last few posts I am definitely not going to do any training with a gym employee without first checking their certifications...I'd bet that any that are eligible for the package deals are not the most qualified.  I hadn't quite decided which route to go, but I think that starting out right the first time is probably best.