the age old debate....are sit ups useless????

i'm wondering if doing situps every day will do anything- if i do about 150 every day, will anything happen?!?!?!?!i mean i've heard they do nothing and that they're the best thing....help me plz! i'm confused :)

If you feel it and it burns I would assume it's doing something to your muscles.  You might have to do more stuff to get like, really good results or burn off the layer of fat above the muscle or faster results or something, but I think situps must do something or they wouldn't be included in so many workouts.  BUT I'm not totally sure...those are just my thoughts =)

If you are feeling a burn and you get that sore feeling in your belly, then it's working.  If you really want some ab definition though, you need a good diet and some cardio also.  That's the hard part.

Doing sit ups vs "ab workout" are 2 different things.  Sit ups are only going to work the front muscles but the sides/ obligues aren't going to work much and you also need to work those.  Do crunches do reverse crunches and doing a whole lot is only going to build endurance and not tone muscle.  Concentrate on working abs for 10 minutes working all the abs.

Ye, there are like 20 different ways or variations to the abs.

but if you are after a six pack, then you need to do other things, like work on your lower back aswell.

to you question, I think why some people say they are bad is because a lot of people don't do them properly and cause strain.

any excersice is bad for you if you don't do it right

ive been doing about 400 a night mixed witrh cardio for a month now and definetly feeling it firming up and seeing some definition

Your AB muscles are no different than anyother muscle. You wouldn't do 200 bench presses with 2 pound dumbbells would you?

Treat the ABs the same way. Do 3 sets of 10 of each AB exercise. And just like any other resistance exercise if you can do more than say 10 or 12 you need to add resistance, e.g. hold a weight to you chest or behind your head, use resistance bands, whatever but find a way to make the muscle work harder, hundreds of reps is not the answer. 

The muscle gets bigger and stronger through increased resistance over time...  (and bigger and stronger = "toned"). Of course you need to lose fat in order to actualy see your nice new muscles, and around the belly can be the hardest place.

Don't rely on the "burn" I can make my bicep "burn" curling a pencil 200 times but I am not really working the muscle and stimulating growth.

"Your AB muscles are no different than anyother muscle. You wouldn't do 200 bench presses with 2 pound dumbbells would you? "

Actually, the ab muscles are much different. they are a different muscle group, one that can recover very quickly. Some people are able to effectively do an ab workout everyday, something that would never be advised for any other group. I think 3 sets of 10 is way to extreme. How about doing better slower more focused sets of difficult ab exercises.

Actually Jill is correct. You work your abs like any other muscle group.

If "they recover very quickly" for you, probably means you're not working them hard enough to cause enough damage to spur signficant growth.  If you're able to do 100s of squats with no added resistance, you can do that every day without soreness too; likewise if you bench press 100s of times with 2 cans of soup, soon your chest will never get sore even if you do that twice each day; etc, etc.

Just try working your abs the way you'd work your chest or quads (i.e., increase resistance over time, sufficient to cause muscle failure after no more than 20 reps), and see what happens.  I only work abs twice a week, because they're typically sore for two days after a workout.

tgpish:

Exactly!!

I have read that for real results, you have to slow down and actually concentrate on what you are doing.  If you're doing 100+, you're most likely cheating a little (bouncing, using pressure of your bum or feet or whatever against the floor instead of your abs), and it's not going to be as effective.  I agree with the people above who say to slow down and try more difficult ab exercises.

Assuming you are doing your ab routine in the correct form, (without straining your neck)  try holding 3-5 pound hand weights in your hands as you do your crunchs.  Make sure to work your obliques, and lower abs as well.

Your abdominal muscles recover very quickly, but you shouldnt work them every day.

I've heard...Not only do you need to do them correctly, but you have to watch what you are eating and  your calorie intake too. You can strengthen the muscles, but if you keep putting fat on it won't matter how many sit ups you do if you aren't eating right either. If you aren't eating right you will still have fat over your muscles.

I heard that crunches or situps are not going to do much like most have said.  You should concentrate on adding resistance, or changing positions IE decline.  The target goal is exercises for the upper, lower, obliques, and back that allow you to only do 20 to 25 reps at most.  Depending on if you want your abs to look big and bulge or just be flat.  Its the same thing with curls for your arms or bench for chest.  The higher wieght and lower reps will biuld size much faster and vise versa for a flat stomach.  Use more reps with less resistance.  But doing 400 situps isnt going to be as efective as doing 25 slow situps with resistance and concentrating on every movement. 

Just somethings to think about.

I don't know how they can be useless. I REALLY LIKE what they're doing for me!!!!!!!!!! I do 450 SLOW ones! I've been trying to cut back though. lol

From what my husband and his body building friends have said. I'd have to agree with thebullpicker on this one.  They ALL say that your abs are very different, need less recovery time and it is safe to work them every day.  HOWEVER, sit-ups are considered the pretty lazy way to work them.  Crunches using weight and other things are considered much better.

Just my .02

Sorry, Ab's are like any other muscle. Science says so... bodybuilder myth says otherwise. I will go with science...

That said... this myth was started by steriod using bodybuilders who can in fact work each muscle everyday because they have chemcials to aid in super fast recovery....

The average non drug using person should train AB's like any other muscle...

This is right up there with saying you can "spot reduce", you can't, you can lose fat overall but cannot target an area of your body to reduce fat on... myths abound but science trumps them all...

Just my .10 :-)

Sorry for the long reply, but please take the time read because I think this answers a lot of the questions/misconceptions raised in this thread

There are some truths to this bodybuilding myth.

abs are composed of a higher percentage of slow twitch muscle fibres. As part of your core muscles they are constantly being used to stabalise your body, even when you are sitting down they are being activated to some extent. If they were not slow twitch they would tire easily and you'd be slouched over your desk after an hour at work. So yes they are different to other muslce groups. (trying supporting your weight on your arms all day)

Despite this,  they still should not be directly exercised every day. They still need time to recover just as any other muscle group does.  Bodybuilders are not typical and can train body parts more regularly because of hormonal and chemical assistance (i.e growth hormone and anabolic steroids). Training abs every day is not advisable for natural and average trainees.

The same protocols apply to abs. you can not spot reduce or 'tone' your abb muscles.

To get visible abbs you need to a) increase the size of your abdominal muscles through anaerobic work b) reduce overall body fat through strict diet and anaerobic/aerboic exercise. These are the only two variables.

400 sit ups a day is a waste of time. You can not do 400 quality repititions any way because once your abs become fatigued (which they will if you are doing them right) your hip flexors and other muscle groups begin to take over, so your ab exercises become no longer ab exercises. Doing four hundred reps of anything makes it an aerobic exercise so it will not develop your abdonimal muscle (in fact it will make them smaller). Since abb exercises are not particularly demanding you will be burning very few calories doing this. So 400 ab crunches every day, while not a complete waste of time since you are moving/exercising, is an extremely inefficient way of achieving 'toned' abs.

The body is not built to work in isolation, it moves as one unit. So all exercise you do exercises your abs to an extent so you do not need to target them every day.  Front squats, deadlifts,  overhead presses,planks and feet elevate press ups will build your abs better than isolation exercises alone. These exercises should make up the core of your ab training. You can add direct isolation work if you need to but once or twice a week should be sufficient.

Not only will these movement train your abs more effectively but since they utilise your whole body you will burn far more calories and boost your post-workout metabolism. I.e they will contribute to lowering your body fat, while building lean body mass. This in conjunction with a controlled diet will result in toned abs/flat stomach.

hope this helps

i think what's really important is to remember to do cardio as well as ab work. you might be toning muscle, but you won't be able to see it with a layer of fat over it! ;)

Kutter83 makes lots of good points. I agree with everything he said :)

But I also think acarr makes a very good point. I know I have killer abs, I can feel em. But this darn layer of fat has to go before I get to enjoy em =D.

That being said, my .o2 is that a few crunches are great, but only a few good ones are really needed. And if you are feel no burn what-so-ever, chances are they aren't doing much for ya. throw is some bicycle and reverse crunchs, leg lifts, planks and the like and you'll be better off. But, thats basically the same thing everyone else said ^_^