Bad Protein?

we all know that there are "bad carbs" (ie: refined sources such as white sugar, white flour, white rice, high-fructose corn syrup, glucose.. etc) they contain no nutritional value, and are all high GI; spiking your blood sugar and dropping it soon after (rollercoaster effect) causing you to want to eat more sugary carbs... this release of insulin in the blood can emphasize fat strorage and thus weight gain

--good carbs cause a slow-steady release of energy and do not spike blood glucose as quickly.. these are found in fruits, vegetables and whole grains. The more fiber the better.

we know about the "bad fats" (ie: saturated and trans fats) saturated are to be limited (they are found in meat, nuts, and dairy so it's best to get lean cuts or low fat versions) and trans fats should be avoided all together.. they are a man made by-product 'lipid' typically found in packaged/processed foods to prolong shelf life (these foods should be avoided as well)

--good fats are the mono- and poly- unsaturated kind, as well as the omegas. These fats are important for proper body function, and are beneficial to overall health, skin and hair... studies show that these fats prolong satiety (feeling of fullness) because they slow digestion, and can help fat/weight loss "eat fat to burn fat"

But what about protein??

I have yet to here someone talk about proteins that should be avoided or limited... do they exist?

some proteins are complete (like animal source proteins) they contain all 9 essesntial amino acids, while others are incomplete (plant proteins) which don't contain all essential amino acids...

but neither one is "bad"

--it's just that if you are a vegetarian you need to get your proteins from multiple sources to ensure that you have a balance of all 9 essential amino acids

...

or am I missing something? are there such proteins that should be avoided/limited?

Probably high fat proteins, like bacon should be limited, also certain cuts of beef and pork should be limited due to fat content.  Liver and other organs (sweetbreads) can have high levels of various things that are not healthy.

I'm guessing that all of the known types of pure proteins are useful and healthy (in moderation, obviously). We are protein-based. All of our cellular functioning is thanks to proteins.

I just learned that apparently soy proteins cause high estrogen levels. That could be considered "bad" in large amounts.

Perhaps if we were fat-based creatures or carb-based creatures then we'd have a need for all forms of fats or carbs, and would not discriminate between "good" and "bad" for those nutrients either.

But since I've never heard the subject breached specifically, I might be way off base. I'm pretty curious now...

The only "bad" proteins, in my opinion, are the ones that are unavoidably combined with saturated fats - bacon, well marbled beef, etc.  If the protein part of the food could be isolated, it would be fine, but you have to eat the fat along with the protein because there is no way to separate it out.

see but thats the thing, it's the fat in the food not the protein that is bad

if fat-free bacon was possible, it wouldn't be so terrible

My two cents: any overly processed protein might be harmful in excess, such as fake soy meats and such things. Maybe also protein powder? Not because of what is stripped, like in the case of simple carbs, but because of what is added. (just to note, I consume both of these, so please refrain for bonking me in the head over what I said)

Also, not sure where the cholesterol resides - is it in the fat or protein part of meat/eggs/dairy? Because if found in protein, that might make it "bad" by certain standards too.

I don't know if you've heard of amino acid completeness, but some foods have more completeness of different types of amino acids than others.  So I guess the completeness level might characterize some proteins as "bad"..

Soy protein in excess can be bad - it has been shown to raise estrogen levels

Original Post by white_sakura:

I don't know if you've heard of amino acid completeness, but some foods have more completeness of different types of amino acids than others.  So I guess the completeness level might characterize some proteins as "bad"..

 I covered that in the post, if you didn't notice

Original Post by white_sakura:

I don't know if you've heard of amino acid completeness, but some foods have more completeness of different types of amino acids than others.  So I guess the completeness level might characterize some proteins as "bad"..

 Get a book from the library - Diet for a Small Planet by Frances Moore Lappe - it explains how complete protein can be obtained from vegetable/grain sources.  It's an interesting concept.  You can get all the protein you need by combining different kinds of foods, and it doesn't have to be all at the same meal.

To answer a previous question, as I understand it animal cholesterol resides in the fat cells of an animal protein.  Cholesterol, in and of itself, is naturally occuring in the body, and is good for us and necessary for proper cell function.  It is the HIGH level of cholesterol in the body that marks whether an individual's level is healthy or unhealthy - and usually that high level is a result of high saturated fatty acids, whether naturally occuring in the body, or ingested...

The only "bad" protein I can think of is gluten (wheat protein), which can cause digestive discomfort to people who are allergic/sensitive. And soy protein is debatable.

I think a fat free bacon would still not be very healthy because of all the sodium.  Also any kinds of processed protein foods might not be too good because of the associated sodium, for me that would cover all of the faux meat products.  

Maybe the good/bad protein dichotomy just hasn't been developed yet by the food producers.  I hate seeing the "0g trans fat" on anything, means nothing to me.  

I believe there's been a push lately toward "more" protein.  I read quite a few snippets here and there about the appropriate number of protein grams one should eat, etc.  I think we're going to be seeing more packaging promoting the number of protein grams per serve.  Not necessarily a good thing IMHO, particularly some of these protein "bars."  

Original Post by figurethefat:

I think a fat free bacon would still not be very healthy because of all the sodium.  Also any kinds of processed protein foods might not be too good because of the associated sodium, for me that would cover all of the faux meat products.  

Maybe the good/bad protein dichotomy just hasn't been developed yet by the food producers.  I hate seeing the "0g trans fat" on anything, means nothing to me.  

I believe there's been a push lately toward "more" protein.  I read quite a few snippets here and there about the appropriate number of protein grams one should eat, etc.  I think we're going to be seeing more packaging promoting the number of protein grams per serve.  Not necessarily a good thing IMHO, particularly some of these protein "bars."  

 That's the point I was going to bring up--some proteins can contain very high amounts sodium, particularly pork products and over-processed meats. On that token, if carbs can be bad because they are processed (white rice, white bread, etc.) then I think it is the same with protein products--however, I think the actual research on protein itself is probably lacking.

On another point, you could consider the source. Cows (and other animals, I believe) are injected with anitbiotics which could potentially be harmful. Not sure if that point really applies to this conversation, though.

Original Post by hswee6473:

Probably high fat proteins, like bacon should be limited, also certain cuts of beef and pork should be limited due to fat content.  Liver and other organs (sweetbreads) can have high levels of various things that are not healthy.

Let's just straighten this out before people get the wrong idea. Fat, carbs and protein are the essential nutrients that we are composed of and that we need to function and live. They are their own individual source of energy. Therefore proteins can not be high in fat content, they can only be connected to another nutrient source that contains fat as well.

I don't want to sound condescending, but when I read that I felt that people might get confused

Looks like the "fat is bad" phobia is a live and well. Proteins are proteins aka amino acids. Each protein source will have a variable amount of amino acids. Some sources will have all  the essential amino acids like animal protein, other sources from plant sources will not and will require more than one source of plant food to make them complete proteins. A varied diet will supply all the amino acids your body requires, unless your a vegan, then supplements may be required. Pretty basic explanation. And while were at it your confusing good carbs and bad carbs with the GI response, which isn't necessarily true..........A snickers bar is a slow releasing carb source and a potato is quick releasing carb source, but i think most people will agree that a potato is healthier. Fruit's a simple carbs and will spike insulin quicker than refined pasta.........Your fat example isn't much better.......this all sounds like conventional dietary guru diarrhea imo. I'm not directing this at you at all, just saying.

"Cows (and other animals, I believe) are injected with anitbiotics which could potentially be harmful."

All medications given to livestock for human consumption have a "withdrawal period". You can't sell a beast into the food chain within x number of days since its last dose, to give time for the medication to be eliminated from the meat carcass.

Personally I avoid the bacon type meats because they seem to increase my arthritic pains. Bread (but not other, non yeasted wheat products) seems to have a similar effect. Again, probably off topic.

Read 'The China Study', which was a 30 year population study based on China, following a massive amount of people and a great number of diseases. You will conclude, as they did, that protien from meat sources is much worse than protein from vegetable sources. By worse I mean if you want to die from cancer or heart disease, then having a diet high in EITHER meats OR high fat OR BOTH will do the trick. This was a study of food consumption and the disease that resulted from it.

I would also suggest anything by Dr. John McDougall - who works with people who have cancer / heart disease / high blood pressue, showing them how to stop, slow, or reverse the course of their diease by diet alone, and he does eliminate meat as a source of protien.

Barring hormones and all that, lean meat is a good protein source.  If you are watching the mg of cholesterol you get from animal sources, then it's not so bad. 

As always a variety of foods is what makes a healthy diet.  Fat is a good thing, especially from vegetable sources.  A meal/snack that has some carbs, some protein and some fat will keep you going longer than a high carb or carb and protein option.  That's why salads with no fat dressing don't keep you filled up for long.  Add a tsp-tbsp of olive oil to it and it'll keep you from getting hungry as fast....

Carbs burn up fast.  Proteins next and fats last.  So food with all three provides immediate, intermediate, and long lasting energy, keeps blood sugar stable and makes you feel less deprived.

Why do we have to label any food as "good" or "bad"?  It just messes with our minds and freaks us out.  I can't eat that, it's "bad".  Calories are calories and the key is moderation.  I'd probably draw the line at eating lard right out of the bucket (yuck, no texture) but a juicy, rare, well marbled steak once in a while isn't going to kill me.  (Well, it might if I add a loaded baked potato, deeped fried onion blossom and triple-layered chocolate cake for dessert.)

I feel the key is to eat what you want, but only if it taste good and satisfies you.  My tips are to eat slowly, look at your food, smell it, take a small bit and actually chew it, savour the flavor, how does it feel in your mouth, sweet, sour, salty, acid.  We Americans eat way to fast and don't taste our food.  Why are French women thin?  Because they take an hour and a half to eat their meal, eat small portions and savour every bite.

So quit labeling your food.  Think about it, you don't  like to be labeled yourself. 

Live well, eat well.