Which is better (for a total beginner!)for toning- pilates or yoga?

In another attempt to do some exercise, my dietitian suggested I try pilates- mainly because I could do it at home following a dvd, and because it may help my back pain that I've had since my second child was born (it gets sore when I'm tired?) I was wondering if it or yoga would be best for someone pretty clueless when it comes to fitness?

In my experience - neither. Not because I think weight training is better (I do, but really not the point), but because I don't think either should be done as a beginner by DVD - an instructor does a lot more than showing you what to do - (s)he watches your form and gives you modifications that can be necessary to prevent you from getting hurt.  I know lots of people love yoga and pilates dvds, but I think especially if you have back problems, neither is something to attempt alone.

That said, I hurt my back in a yoga class with a trained instructor, so I'm not convinced that yoga helps with a sore back, although I'm sure there are many who would disagree. For me, my back has been helped through weight training, because, as far as I can tell, the reasons I have problems with my back is from lack of strength, and weight training helps that.

Both yoga and pilates (when combined with a calorie deficit) will actually decrease your muscle tone.

The amount of flexion in the lumbar spine that both systems emphasize will do more harm than good reguarding back pain.

Original Post by floggingsully:

Both yoga and pilates (when combined with a calorie deficit) will actually decrease your muscle tone.

The amount of flexion in the lumbar spine that both systems emphasize will do more harm than good reguarding back pain.

 Interesting opinion.

I would say start with yoga a few times week to build strength then go to pilates. I practice with yoga instructors 2-3 times a week. I started yoga to help with my breathing because I had depression and wanted off medications. I have never hurt myself in yoga. Usually people hurt themselves because they don't listen to their bodies and force themselves into more then their bodies can handle.

I also get bored weight training it is to repetitive.

Just to clarify - I am ridiculously careful with my back, and so it wasn't because I didn't listen to to my body, but because the instructor had us doing something that past experience should have told me would end up causing me pain (the pain kicked in a day later), and I should not have kept doing. But because at the time, it didn't hurt, I kept going, only to sincerely regret it later. It wasn't the instructor's fault, but it wasn't because I pushed myself too far.

I don't get bored weight training, because I keep my routine changing, and every time I lift I have a new goal. But that's not what this thread was about.

 To a beginner, just about anything will be good assuming you can do it without risk - I'd actually peg Pilates to be safer to do off a DVD than yoga. Not completely safe mind you, but then again, there's very few exercise methods that are completely safe to do without being instructed by someone competent.

 Even the stuff you'd think would come naturally - like walking and running - you can benefit tremenduously from participating in a clinic and being taught how to do it right for your body type, so getting in-person instructions is pretty much always preferable if you can get it.

Original Post by floggingsully:

Both yoga and pilates (when combined with a calorie deficit) will actually decrease your muscle tone.

The amount of flexion in the lumbar spine that both systems emphasize will do more harm than good reguarding back pain.

I don't really believe that any part of this to be an entirely true statement. Pilates can increase your muscle 'tone' by using your own body weight as resistance and create longer leaner muscles. I do both yoga and pilates and I have not experienced any sort of decrease in muscle 'tone' in fact I would like to state that from my personal experience I have gotten the exact opposite of that.

I also think that pilates and yoga can help to a certain point with back issues. I sit at a desk all day and often used to go home with 'computer back' which is stiff and achy but since I started yoga/pilates I have developed a stronger core allowing me to hold my body upright with better posture. Over the last couple months I have noticed a drastic decrease in back pain to the point where I no longer experience this issue.

So I guess that I disagree based on my own personal experiences however I realize that not everyones body reacts to certain things the same way. Although I do not see how if done slowly and properly exercises design to stretch and strengthen the muscles in the back and core of your body "could do more harm than good reguarding back pain" but I would consult with your doctor regarding your specific back pain before starting any sort of new routine.

kmw - How much longer are your muscles, and how long did you do pilates before they elongated? Is it all muscles, or just your legs and arms?

longer muscles is a term used by both my pilates and yoga instructors and explained as as a way of describing the increased flexibility in the muscle. The more flexibility the 'longer' the muscle begins to feel.  

I have been doing Pilates and Yoga for about 6 months. I have really noticed a lot of difference in my range of motion of my arms, back, legs and stomach. 

Btw I thought we cleared up the whole "long muslce/short muscle" thing awhile ago... muscles dont get longer or shorter.. they either bulge and make it LOOK short.. or they are narrow and give it a longer LOOK, unless your talking about slow twitch and fast twitch, that is...

Ok so I admit that using the term 'longer' when describing the benefits that I have gotten from my pilates and yoga classes in this post sounded rather strange and inaccurate outside of class. I am fully aware that muscles do not get longer or shorter. It would have been more accurate a description if instead of using longer to describe an increase in my flexibility as done as a term in my classes to just have stated that I had increase in flexibility allowing a better and easier range of motion.  It is not a statement used to describe the way the muscle LOOKS but rather how it FEELS as you become more flexible. 

I had this whole discussion the first week that I was taking the classes as the instructor explained it to me and I admit that outside of a yoga/pilaties class that term sounds really bad.

Sorry about the misunderstanding  : )

Here are my 2 cents---I am a yoga instructor (and sometime pilates). Yoga WILL make you stronger and more flexible AND help your back depending on the type of yoga! ALL of my personal research and experience, and the published research will support that. Do NOT do a "power" or Ashtanga class if you are new... too easy to get injurred. Live instructors are better than DVD's for beginners....Pilates is great for your back and core and is partially designed FROM yoga. Plus the deep breathing and concentration is great for stress reduction (helps when you have kids!) PLUS you can do yoga WITH kids!!! MY suggestion would be to find a community class and take a few weeks with an instructor than try a DVD or two. please contact me directly if you want more info!

Original Post by carolann5111:

Here are my 2 cents---I am a yoga instructor (and sometime pilates). Yoga WILL make you stronger  and more flexible AND help your back . depending on the type of yoga! ALL of my personal research and experience, and the published research will support that . Do NOT do a "power" or Ashtanga class if you are new... too easy to get injurred. Live instructors are better than DVD's for beginners....Pilates is great for your back and core and is partially designed FROM yoga. Plus the deep breathing and concentration is great for stress reduction (helps when you have kids!) PLUS you can do yoga WITH kids!!! MY suggestion would be to find a community class and take a few weeks with an instructor than try a DVD or two. please contact me directly if you want more info!

Um, how to you increase the resistance in yoga? if you can't increase resistance you can't get stronger?

how does forcing your back into an unnatural position make it better? the lower back was designed for stability, not flexion and twisting

have links to any of this research to support yoga helping people's backs?

~nods to sullys post~

Plenty of yoga poses require you to support your bodyweight for an extended period of time.  People who can't yet support their bodyweight in the full pose can do modifications, and as they get stronger, do more difficult versions of the pose.

If someone is already strong enough to do multiple pushups and do a handstand, then a yoga chattarange and headstand won't build strength for them.  If someone finds that they need to modify poses and hold them only for a short period time, then yoga will build strength for them. 

Strength is relative to a starting point.

Personally, I prefer pilates. A lot of the time they incorporate weights into the routine, so when it becomes to easy to do alone, you can just add some!

Original Post by floggingsully:

Both yoga and pilates (when combined with a calorie deficit) will actually decrease your muscle tone.

The amount of flexion in the lumbar spine that both systems emphasize will do more harm than good reguarding back pain.

 wtf.. are you serious?  Sorry, I usually try to post positively but I couldn't let this pass.  Although I do not enjoy pilates, I know many of my coworkers (Phys Ther)  find that after a patient has gone thourgh a course of PT for back pain, that pilates is the place they send their patients to build core strength and continue to keep the pain at bay.  On a more personal note,  I practice yoga, I teach yoga, and I assure you my muscle tone can kick your ass.  (Sorry that was uncalled for.)  But please,  make sure of your facts before you comment.  I agree, yoga wouldn't be the best place for back rehab, but my back, core etc has never been stronger.  So irishmum do your homework on what is best for you.  Good Luck.

PS,  Sorry I took your posting into kind of a rant.

Original Post by betzc:

Original Post by floggingsully:

Both yoga and pilates (when combined with a calorie deficit) will actually decrease your muscle tone.

The amount of flexion in the lumbar spine that both systems emphasize will do more harm than good reguarding back pain.

wtf.. are you serious? Sorry, I usually try to post positively but I couldn't let this pass. Although I do not enjoy pilates, I know many of my coworkers (Phys Ther) find that after a patient has gone thourgh a course of PT for back pain, that pilates is the place they send their patients to build core strength and continue to keep the pain at bay. On a more personal note, I practice yoga, I teach yoga, and I assure you my muscle tone can kick your ass. (Sorry that was uncalled for.) But please, make sure of your facts before you comment. I agree, yoga wouldn't be the best place for back rehab, but my back, core etc has never been stronger. So irishmum do your homework on what is best for you. Good Luck.

PS, Sorry I took your posting into kind of a rant.

oh here we go again. anyway i think what irishmum can take from this is to go to a good recommended instructor that helps you correct your form no matter if you do weights, yoga or pilates. this is the health of your back.

my husband (still not used to that word) took a yoga class with me & the stupid woman didn't correct or help him at all even tho he told her that he has never done yoga before. the poses dont just 'come to you'. i had to help him in the end.

betzc, i understand what you are saying as i have friends that are instructors, however i believe scully has some pretty good uh, 'muscle tone'. one of my friends has a really nice body but thats because she's an instructor, went through years of training, does it all the time etc. as a lay person who only has maybe 30 minutes 3x week its some what unlikely they will get the same results, especially as fast as they could with lifting. at least from what ive seen in my friend's classes (pfft, not that i would ever get a discount).

maybe im just being piggy in the middle but i have scoliosis & ive done pilates, yoga & lifting. all three have their places, all tho i prefer doing yoga as its initial intended use.

Oops- I seemed to have opened a can of worms here? I thought it'd be a simple reply? I asked which one I could follow at home as I live in rural Ireland and yoga/pilates classes are unheard of here (well, maybe in the bigger cities?) The only 'exercise' class is a tai-bo (sp?) class and its a 20min drive away- which isn't an option?

I wanted to incorporate some 'gentle' toning into my life and my dietitian suggested these two options. If anyone can suggest something else I'm open to suggestions? It has to be something I can do at home though? 

Original Post by irishmum:

Oops- I seemed to have opened a can of worms here? I thought it'd be a simple reply? I asked which one I could follow at home as I live in rural Ireland and yoga/pilates classes are unheard of here (well, maybe in the bigger cities?) The only 'exercise' class is a tai-bo (sp?) class and its a 20min drive away- which isn't an option?

I wanted to incorporate some 'gentle' toning into my life and my dietitian suggested these two options. If anyone can suggest something else I'm open to suggestions? It has to be something I can do at home though? 

can you not just get someone over to show you just a couple of times? or see a phyical or physio therapist to show you some strengthen exercises. just from myself having back problems.... i just feel that someone showing you even just for a couple of times would worth a little extra money. just how rural are you?