Body Fat / Goal Wieght ... BlaaaaaH

Ok so when i started i wasn't fat, ive never been fat, but i did want to get in better shape at first i though i just needed to lose a few pounds but after the wonderful help and support from the guru's i learn't a few things.

I learned i wasn't fat, i was just carriying to much fat compared to the amount of lean mass i had, and that i could lose wiehgt till the cows came home i was never going to look like a bikini model unless i got some muscle on my bones and toned up.

So having modified my goals somewhat lost some wiehgt and gained some muscle im looking for new goals, and um not sure a number on a set of scales is ever gonig to give me what i want.

Origionally i'd said if i could get to about  112-115lb's i'd be happy but i now realise saying such a thing is silly because i don't know how much the muscle i need to gain is gonig to wiegh or how much i'll lose in fat untill i reach my goal.

Instead i think a body fat rating is a much better way of setting myself a goal but in all honesty i dont know what a certain % looks like ive said that i think 18% would look nice but tbh i how no idea what 18% looks like.

How do you guys set goals? and does anyone know any good pictures of women with various body fat ratings?? so i can judge??

 

  

 

leiela,

i still think it would be depending on how they carry the weight that isn't lean mass.  It might look skinny to others, but however it is distributed is another thing.  I have 18% BF, but I am striving for a more leaner look, I have always been muscular though and it's easier for me to acheive dropping BF than it is for me to really lose weight because the moment i start weightlifting I seem to just even out.  When I was an unhealthy athlete my BF was 13% but I struggled ot keep that lean muscle that was ever so genetic for me to have.  I was only about 113-118lbs, but most of my muscle wasn't there much more, I wasn't as strong as before either.  BUt that weight may be ideal for other sin my height range, but it doen't look righ ot on every one, if you have a different body composition. After having children it is harder to get rid of troublsome areas, and some people are just bound to carry more BF because of their lack of muscle mass.  I've read that you've been working out a lot and still haven't seen results...I'm sure you;ve tried it all, but there is patience and also learning what is best for you not what is best on someone elses body.  I love Oxygen magazine.  you can look at the website and see women of all sizes with Bf of 13%-15% they are thletes and compete and usually train to reduce their BF so that the definition of the muscle comes through for competitions, but the pictures ar enice to look at for motivation.  you are never going to get a real idea of what YOU should look like comparing yourself to someone else, because we are all composed differently. 

Melkor, just posted this on another post and I think he makes since of everything he posts. He give sounds opinions and good advve, but here is a tidbit of what he posted about BF%'s:

Body Fat Guidelines from American Council on Exercise
 Classification  Women (% Fat)      Men (% Fat)
Essential Fat     10-12 percent     2-4 percent
Athletes            14-20 percent      6-13 percent
Fitness      &n bsp;       21-24 percent     14-17 percent
Acceptable        25-31 percent     18-25 percent 

A Figure or Fitness competitor or a fitness model will typically diet down to about 12-14% for competitions and photo shoots; normal off-season maintenance levels are typically either in the 15-17% bracket if you have a lot of modelling work in your offseason or 18-20% if you don't and are going to add some more muscle to your frame for next competition season.

 Bodybuilders typically take things to more extremes than Figure competitors do, and get onstage at about 7-9%; the equivalent of the male bodybuilder's stage weight and equally insanely unhealthy as what the men get up to. This state is sustainable for about half a day, a day tops and usually ends with the competitor going off the stage and eating everything in sight to get back up to a sustainable level.

 Movie and media stars like the Jessicas Alba, Biel and Simpson will typically stay in the 15-17% range unless a role calls for anything different; most athletes who care about sports performance will typically stay at the 18-20% bracket since the body simply performs better at that level.

I set 15% as a goal for most females I work with.

At 15% you still carry enough fat to have regular menstrual cycles but are still quite lean. Such a level can also be realistically maintained.

18% bodyfat - http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/trans22f.jpg

15% - http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/images/2006/t ransf73b.jpg

This link has a massive list of women who have turned their lives around - pictures are included and will give you an idea of what you would look like at different bodyfat levels:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/trans_f.htm

Hope that helps.

Yeah it helps tons thanks most of the girls i liked the look of where about 14-15% .. not sure how it will look on my i have a really odd frame, short legs and square shoulders but it gives me a rough goal.

I certainly want something maintainable and im not a model or athete although i am a dancer (currently trying ot get back into shape) so i need something thats looks good all year round but is maintainable with effort.

You say 15% is maintainable?? and is there any way of working out roughly how many pounds i'll need to lose to get to that??  i know im currently about 22% ish 119lbs 5ft3

How do i go about increasing muscle? as i know i can't really gain it on a deficit. i've been workout out heavily for about 8 weeks now and my weight hasn't changed much but i can tell im getting much leaner gone from about 25% body fat to 22% and ive lost inches all over.

However In the last week i've notice the scale finnally starting to drop which leads me to belive im comming to the end of my newbie gains as far as muscle is concerned and im guessing im not likely to gain much more while dieting to lose the fat.

So should i get down to about 15% then build muscle or increase muscle now and then lose the fat? because i suspect if i lose alot of weight in my current condition my family will have a panic attack about me wasting away as i still don't think have enough of the lean stuff to stop myself looking like im about to fall down a grid if i drop to 15%....

 

If your long term goal is to be 14-15% with more muscle than you have at present I would recommend you get down to that level first before working to put on some muscle.

It's pretty simple really: the more fat you have to start with, the more fat you will gain when you attempt to put on muscle. If you are very lean to start with, more of the calories you eat will go to muscle growth and less will go to fat cells.

At 119lbs and 22% bodyfat you have a Lean Body Mass (LBM) of 93 pounds and carry 26 pounds of fat (not as bad as it sounds).

If you drop 10 pounds of pure fat and 2 pounds of water weight (just a guess), you will be 107 pounds with 16 pounds of fat = almost exactly 15%.

I can see why you would be concerned with your weight at that level as ~110 pounds at 5'3" is very light.

However, I would recommend you get yourself to that level for the reasons stated above. Remember that once you lean out you can jump into muscle gain and thus won't stay at 110 pounds for long. Also, muscle is far more dense than fat and thus someone at 110 pounds with 14-16% bodyfat will look far healthier than someone at 110 pounds with 30-40% fat.

If you feel that 110 pounds is too low for you I suppose you could go ahead and work to put on some muscle put to be perfectly honest with you it isn't ideal.

Concerning whether or not 15% is maintainable...absolutely. If you keep you diet in check and don't slack off in the gym 15% is a very healthy level to be at and is a very realistic lifestyle goal as opposed to something you achieve for a month or two.

I hope I've answered all your questions...if not, just ask again...

Yeah im concidered slim already my arms legs etc are fine its just my belly thats flabby atm, im not gonna tell my hubby i plan to drop 10lb's haha he had a fit when i planned to drop 10lbs when i was 124lb... he and my mother are acting like im anorexic already.

i'll see how low i can get before people start throwing serious fits, i understand thier concerns and i love for caring but its really not my intention to kill myself or do anything harmful i just want to look and feel good about my body, and i think what i want is achevable without being unhealthy... tbh i don't think either understand the concept of skinny fat as it where ... your either fat or thin as far as thier concerned people can't be both.

I want to be slim but shapely the whole victoria beckham waif look is seriously unattractive so i know i'm gonna need to build muscle to be about 15% body fat without looking pretty scarey.

I want to keep my curves (well i'd like to build some haha) you know look toned like i take care of myself without looking like i don't eat ... i always thought lingery models looked far better than waif like super models, but i'd like a bit of muscle behind it .. so people can really tell i look after myself and im not just a lucky genetic accident haha .. you know have abit of definition.

im not sure if im upto the challenge but i hope so ... ive been working REALLY REALLY hard so far and im proud of what ive done, i just hope i can get the fat off because so far the scales are bieng stubborn and if it wasn't for the tape measure i would have lost my mind a few weeks ago...

i just hope the 1lb's i've droped this week is a sign of things to come ...because ive been told its very hard to get the last few pounds off.

a few years ago I was about 115-117lbs, 5'2 and had my body fat measured.

I was told it was TOO HIGH for someone my height, weight, age and frame size... I never was 'fat' but I could afford to lose some weight or tone up.

I don't remember the exact percentage, but I think it was like 25-27%!

a few years later or so due to my ED my weight went down to 87lbs, I lost my period for months, but then got it back at around 92lbs! Supposivly you need to have a certain amount of body fat to menstruate, so if I had enough body fat at such a low weight, I am starting to believe that my 'ideal' weight is probably lower than the BMI charts say I should weigh... I'm thinking around 100-105lbs.

just a thought.

altough I would be fine if I weighed more in lean muscle and actually looked thinner then at a lower weight with fattier tissue... but I'm not sure how i would go about doing that... supposivly its genetics that determine where your body stores fat/weight

Well, I don't post pictures of myself on the Internet, but my body fat is between 15 and 16% and I still look feminine: I have all the requisite parts, including a 32C breast size. In fact, I had no idea my body fat was that low until I had it professionally tested. I never set a body-fat goal: I just worked on building muscle and looking the way I wanted to in my clothes. I'm not even all that strict about what I eat: I've just been working out for 18 years.

I am 5' 3 1/2" and 110.

Arh thats great Petite_Powerhouse, im about 5ft3 so i guess where about the same size, i worry about how my family will react if i drop my fat too low im husband already think's im losing my ability to rationalise the way i look ...

Don't get me wrong i know i don't look bad now but i think i could look better, and i don't ee anything wrong withwanting to get fit and healthy.

i just wish the best way of getting to how i want to look wasn't losing the fat before gaining the muscle because i know that it's that "fat gone" before the build stage thats gonna stress everyone out totally (probabally me included because im gonna look terrible i go so gaunt when i lose wieght)... but i know its the best way of doing.

I'm 22% body fat atm and i do have a reasonable amount of muscle im not a total wimp .. i squated 27.5kg 5X5 today so i was pretty chuffed to bits haha... even though i must have looked a right wally trying to get that wieght up onto my shoulders ... i was fine once it was their but my arms arn't as stong as my legs so i stuggled getting it there... haha.

if i manage to get myself to about 15-16% how much maintaince is it to keep myself there?? im asuming i'll be able to up my calories etc atm maintaince for me is about 2000, i know it go's up the more muscle you have, and down the less you wieght so im not sure how t will work out if about about 110lb with decent muscle???

Also what about working out?? I work out 5 days a week right now and im pretty active on the other 2 espeically in the summer when i can take my kids the park , is that neough to reach my goal? and again what about maintaining it?? will i still need to work out as much as i do getting myself their (not that i mind i love the gym)

 

Hi.......revising your goals like this is a terrific idea. I had to do the same thing. Though I've never been grossly overweight or anything, due to a spinal injury I was 33% body fat even though I weighed only 123 lbs., a decent number for someone 5' 5"...........I felt horrible and was a size 4. Once I got moving and started weight training, I reduced my body fat to 16%, which is very close to really athletic for a mother of four that had hardly moved in 10 years. Now I LOVE the exercise, have many buddies at the gym, and wear a size zero while weighing very close at 122 lbs! I have lost so many inches it is ridiculous! The last time I was a size zero I was half-starved and close to 100 lbs.......it IS all about the weight training. I eat 1500-1800 calories a day and revised my diet to vegan, which refined my body even more, as I was sure to add whey protein shakes totalling 70-105 grams a day depending on the degree of exercisse. I'm 43 and have never looked or felt better. Hope this encourages you to keep lifting! Good luck and HAVE FUN!

I've also been thinking about lowering my BF% and getting toned instead of the goal to reach "x" pounds. Out of curiosity, I went to a site and that calculated my BF% and I literally gasped when I saw it:

Body Fat: 26.69 % Fat Weight: 31.8 pounds Lean Weight: 87.2 pounds

So, if I'm understanding it right, first drop the extra weight and then using weights work on lowering body fat? It there any kind of time guesstimation for how long it takes to lower BF% after dropping the extra pounds?

Edited to add I have a BMI of 19

Not necessarily......I was 32% body fat and 123 lbs. I'm now 16% body fat and 118 pounds......the loss of pounds was LAST for me.....changing my body composition was first. I only started to lose weight when I drastically changed my eating habits.....I started by cutting out refined sugar and white flour.....then after 6 months or so I went vegan as well. I eat more look great and feel energized and fabulous. I just posted my story and e-mail with this site under profiles. If you know how to access that go read it. If you want my help, I'd be happy to give it to you!

Original Post by queenmedia:

 

I've also been thinking about lowering my BF% and getting toned instead of the goal to reach "x" pounds. Out of curiosity, I went to a site and that calculated my BF% and I literally gasped when I saw it:

Body Fat: 26.69 % Fat Weight: 31.8 pounds Lean Weight: 87.2 pounds

So, if I'm understanding it right, first drop the extra weight and then using weights work on lowering body fat? It there any kind of time guesstimation for how long it takes to lower BF% after dropping the extra pounds?

Edited to add I have a BMI of 19

 I have an BMI of 21 atm when i started 8 weeks ago i had a body fat of 26, so i've basically lost about 6% in 8 weeks, which i think is pretty damn good especially concidering the scales think i've only lost 2lb's haha.

I'f you weight train your lose the fat and keep your currently muscle so your % comes down as you lose the weight.

An injury a few months ago is how i go into this mess i was probabally about 20% before hand, not great but not bad eiter funny how much your body can go to pot when you sit on you ass for a few months.

the scales are just slowely cracking me up i needed to find another wya of doing this, besides i realised a number wasn't gonig to gve me the look i wanted.

I think i just realised that 2 girls with the same build at the same weight could look totally different and as one of thoses girls id be happy and the other one i wouldn't be.

As a side note, the scales pretty much didn't budge for 8 weeks to keep my sanity i've assumed that was a period of newbie gains and that while the scales didn't show it i was losing fat and gaining heavy muscle, which replaced the fat weight wise and my drop in inches / body fat reading seems to back this up.

However this week i did suddenly drop a pound so im hoping my newbie gain stage is over and i can just get right down to losing the fat, however im nervous the fat won't budge.

I'm eating reasonably cleanly my carbs tend end up abit high and my protien is still about low im looking at 25/30/45 fat/protien/carbs most days, and im eating about 1,400 cals per day while working out 5 days a week, 2 days Hiit and 3 days weights does this sound right??

 

 

 

 

Gah not even a week in and already it's started, my mum bless her emailed me this

Your BMI is 20.4 - healthy weight

Your BMI is below the healthy range. You should not try to lose any weight, and putting on a few pounds may benefit your health.

Your weight is within the healthy range. Making sure you have a balanced diet and taking regular exercise will help you to stay fit and healthy. If you feel that you want to lose weight in order to feel more comfortable with your body shape, try making small, healthy changes to your eating habits and taking more exercise. You should not aim to weigh less than a BMI of 20.

How bleeding annoying is that??? im trying to do something healthy and turn my unhealthy habits into healthy ones and my mum is acting like im anorexic !!!! GAH!!!!

Someone please tell me she not right??? wanting to replace my fat with lean mass isn't wrong or unhealthy is it???

 

 Not unhealthy at all - though you might want to think about trying on a 'lean recomposition' for size; something like what Jen Heath describes in her Let's Get Jacked: Part II program.

In my experience, you're right and she IS wrong and she must be my own mother's twin! I SWEAR!!!! 

My mom is over herself now that she's seen the results....she honestly can't believe the change! She thought by exercising I'd lose weight and be a stick figure. I'm thin, but BECAUSE I'm fit and recently she said to me, "I can't believe how HEALTHY you look, you're still small, but you're solid"........she quit bitching at me about it all after that...........the proof is IN your HEALTH and it will be noticed.

Please don't believe you have to lose any weight to do this.....you really don't! You will, in my opinion end up MUCH healthier if you don't try to lose and gain muscle that is hard and not as healthy as changing your body composition..... HONEST!

Original Post by melkor:

 Not unhealthy at all - though you might want to think about trying on a 'lean recomposition' for size; something like what Jen Heath describes in her Let's Get Jacked: Part II program.

 thanks, melkor, i hadn't actually ever read that before. 

Original Post by melkor:

 Not unhealthy at all - though you might want to think about trying on a 'lean recomposition' for size; something like what Jen Heath describes in her Let's Get Jacked: Part II program.

 Ooooooh im all confused now,

Get jacked Part one suggested i should build muscle first so i'd fire up my metabalism and make burning the fat easier later, and if i read i right part two assumes you have a reasonable level of muscle already (not sure i have enough to move straight to part two) and that to can re-comp simultaniously by cycling your calories and other people have said i should get rid of the fat first before trying any real building,

Argh

I'm so confused, i've been doing this 8 weeks so far and im still totally baffled as to what i should be doing amt i feel like im floundering in the dark praying something works.

 

 

Gosh so to be a total pain in the butt .... but im baffled beyond baffled.... I've heard so many sugestions, read so many articles and they've all just left me confused, everyone seems to have a different opinion and everyone seems to have a really good reason / argument as to why "thier" plan works.

Being so confused and hearing so many arguments means im constently changing my plan and what im doing which im pretty sure is doing me no favor's what so ever.

So ive decided i need a plan, and i need a plan i can stick too.....

Ok so what do we know ... im 5ft3 , 119lbs and about 22-23% body fat. I want to get to about 15-18% depending how i feel and look when i get close, i also don't want to be a skinny waif i'd like abit of muscle behind me to pad me out.

So knowing this we know i need to :-

1. Lose Fat
2. Gain Muscle

The options as far as i can tell come down to 3 things :-

1. Lose the fat first then bulk out.
2. Gain the muscle first then strip the fat
3. Try and Carb/Calorie Cycle and try and do both at the same time.

What do you guys think?

At around 22-ish% I think I'd go for the lean recomposition, honestly. Yes, bulking is more efficient when you're already a very lean - theoretically. See, no matter what you can at best expect to put on about 70-80% muscle, the rest will be fat. If you're already very lean, you can monitor your progress and switch to a burn strategy once you've gained a couple pounds muscle and half a pound of fat - but keep in mind that this also works best if you can't reasonably expect to see newbie gains.

 That ain't you - with 8 weeks of training at most you're still in your "Beginner's Luck" stage. Which means you can reasonably expect to break the rules at it were and gain muscle even in a calorie deficit for a brief while yet- though the process would be slightly more efficient in a calorie surplus you are not yet past the newbie stage. So as of right now I'd personally recommend you consider part II of the get jacked program until your newbie gains run out and then consider where you are in relation to your desired body composition.

 No program works forever anyway - changing every 8-12 weeks is about right for a beginner, more intermediate trainees change every 6-8, and the really advanced ones change every 3 weeks or thereabouts. (Advanced as in "how far have you advanced towards fulfilling your genetic potential", the closer you are to that, the more you need to vary your training to force your body to adapt in the way you want it.)

 So I think that right now - well, just pick one program, try it for a few weeks, and see how it works for you.

Ok so if i get the jist of the part 2 program,

• i eat at a low carb deficit (about 1,300cals??)on my 2 cardio days and my rest days, making sure get lots of protien at least 119g, and about 60g-90g fat and carbs should mostly be green veggy's
• On my lifting days i eat at maintainance (1,900cals) adding more carbs (especially just after my workout) to make up the extra calories without letting my fats and protein slip?? (gulp 1,900cals seems Sooooo Much i don't think ive ever eaten that much in my life !!! )

What about all the suppliments it mention's ??? i live in england and i'd have to order them are they really needed?? i could buy the equivilants, i already use whey (its the only way i seem to manage to keep my protein up) but do i need the others?? i don't mind buying anything that will help but would rather not waste money if its not needed, as im aware the website is trying to "sell" these products so is bound to suggest all sorts.. haha.

Heres the training schedual it suggests which i can manage np. Infact it's not that different to what im doing already except it seems to want to replace my Hiit with regular cardio, and add's a workout on a saturday but i guess taking the kids the park to play ball would count as cardio.

• Monday: Lower body
  Tuesday: Low intensity cardio
  Wednesday: Upper body
  Thursday: Low intensity cardio
  Friday: Full body
  Saturday: Low intensity cardio with HIT as optional