Posts by tuffstuff07

Regardless of BMI, I think the fact that you have to keep yourself at such a low calorie level to maintain that weight is a sign that your body would be happier--work better and you would feel better—at a higher weight. 

I’m not saying eat 3000 calories until you Reach X bmi.  I’m saying based purely on what your body wants, if it’s maintaining on such a low level of calories it’s making them stretch, either because it’s at too low a weight or because it hasn’t been fed enough yet.  Either case [or both] your best bet is to increase what you eat until your body can maintain on a NORMAL [not super metabolism] level of calories—that’s where it wants to be.

P.S. I read every word and even delayed my response so I could give you a "real" one, not just an initial reaction.

Original Post by mel_ynda:

Thanks, heaps, Meagan!

If you have a dietitian monitoring your weight, I say go for it and get rid of those scales.  Not only are they an inaccurate way of measuring your true weight, they are completely a dead loss when it comes to measuring your worth.  Who you are will never be decided by silly numbers on a silly machine. 

I am still on 3500 cals but am eating extra things that I don't know the cal content of to challenge myself. 

I'm glad you're doing so well, and I hope you're holding purging at bay.  I know you said you were struggling in earlier posts.  Don't forget you're gaining, so the  more food, the merrier!

Mel. xox

 Keep at it girl!  Keep in mind that the more you gain and more you stick to higher and higher calories, the harder it may be to keep up with your body and keep the gain going.  Sometimes you need to increase weekly until the gain has been 2lbs/week consistently. Otherwise odds are pretty good you could wind up in the same basic range halfway through 2009--and who wants that?!  Take it all the way--your BIGTIME LIFE awaits!

Well, there are several factors going on here.  The first thing is that you have a predisposition to a certain amount of muscle mass, as determined by your genes.  Your body will naturally build that back when it gets to that. 

However, after starving your body first uses it's resources towards the basics-internal organs, function, etc.  If you're not giving it enough calories to truly feel "comfortable" to maintain more muscle mass, it may also build less muscle than it would like to naturally just because it's scared it won't get enough food to do so. 

[That's one reason it's so important to not just eat enough to gain with your body in hoarding mode, but enough to give your body the signal that it can work right and get some muscle going on!]

The information given about giving your body stimulus for muscle growth are true in a different situation--a body that has not been malnourished or kept underweight.  But until you reach a healthy weight and function, it doesn't really matter--if anything, putting too much "demand" on a recovering body with activity can scare it into storing more fat--because right now it's bigger concern is survival and basic health.

Original Post by butterfly_in_the_sky:

 However i dont seem to have seen this metabolic rebound or 'hypermetabolism' everyone is talking about.

That’s because you still haven’t given your body above what it needs to get by, much less a weight gain diet + extras to repair.  All that has to happen plus a consistent extra for the full rebound.  Why, as I’ve pointed out, the extreme rebounds are so often seen IP—patient allowed no exercise [wheelchair/bed rest] and consistent cals—commonly discharged on 5000. If you stay below the threshold or remain active [even partially], your body just keeps making good use of what it’s got.

I wrote a bit more about it in the past, and even on my last post on the eating-today thread.  Exercise and limited eating [meaning eating that isn't OVERboard what you would need with a normal metabolism] works against the rebound.

Also worth noting-wanting the extreme metabolism is a key sign that your body is still starving.  Otherwise you wouldn't want to have to eat so much more!

Agru-

Wise words you have now, but here’s a little push for YOU to take the next step, keep moving forward—and dare I challenge you to confront some real possible fears or ED holds?!

Here’s a real challenge to kick some ED butt and take over your life:

Get off the whole “3000 calorie” security blanket, and fear as though “missing calories” or going over is somehow your doom sentence. 
1. You WANT to move forward, not stick there
2. For life, you don’t WANT to concern yourself over catsup, veggies, etc.
   That’s not something you should ever have to factor in to your calorie range, so why do
     it now when you still have to gain + rebuild the nongaining stuff?

Antother thing ED seems to antagonize you over is exercise.  Some rational reminders:
1. Your perceptions are still distorted.  You haven’t been “not working out.”  I’m not saying what you have been doing is overexercizing or too much or too little or anything like that—BUT how you label it IS still distorted.  Going for walks is activity.  Lifting, however light, is too.  In the hospital where I am now working, when a patient reaches their activity weight, they get to get out of the wheel chair and walk down the hall.  THAT is activity.  You are far beyond that.
2. It’s the ED telling you that doing “too little” is the thing to fear.  Remember every extra move you make could hold you back from your full potential in healing, function, redeeming yourself, and where you end up with metabolism, health, and activity requirements.  Focus on this step and what you need, and don’t jinx yourself!

On the IBS, I’d love to hear any coping techniques you’ve found.  I have looked up a bunch at work and here on IBD/IBS diets and get some mixed messages, so I’m thinking I’ll have to experiment for myself, but need some guidelines to start from.  I know I’m going to have to eliminate soy and lactose more thoroughly [allergies more than IBS], but beyond that I have to set some guidelines.  I’ve been in a flare up this weekend, so I might go a couple days on an extreme healing diet.  I’ve heard eating 3X soluble to insoluble helps, but during healing to completely eliminate insoluble fiber.  Spicy foods, big meals, and temperature of foods are other things for me to work on.

Dolly-just an fyi the hyper metabolistm happens from extremely high calories and restricted exercise.  One reason it doesn’t always happen outpatient is because a person recovering can’t get themselves to eat normal [2500-3000] levels of calories, let alone 3500-5000, plus keep themselves inactive.

Speaking of hypermetabolism, even without the ED boost I’ve experienced it this week.  I made the goal to have not one day under 4000cals in November [coming from 3000-3500 while running and a slow but not steady gain], and gained 3lbs immediately.  Well, after over a week I’m all the way back to my low point from the summer [the 3lbs +1].
SO FRUSTRATED—will I ever get anywhere? L

Ok quick update on me!  Busy times lately.  I’m working with some inpatient clients now, so going through a LOT of training on nutrition formulas specific for specialized diets, tube feeding, and more.  I’m still trying to keep up with studies for my grad school pursuits, but with the new work and all I might actually wait another year.  I’m already in a field I love, and next year I’ll have more $$ and references. We’ll see…

For my weight gain I plateued at a measly 1-2lb gain despite cutting out my running [currently injured-boo!] and keeping my cals the same and then increasing by 500.  Darn metabolism catches up with me every time I get really stubborn about increasing!  So my November goal is to not have one day below 4000.  It’s been a bit painful so far.  You know it’s a high calorie diet when your burping back up the most calorie dense foods and drinks out there! [aka not just stuffed on tons of light stuff].

Another thing making it all more difficult is I have stomach problems that go beyond just lots of eating.  I might be dealing with some type of irritable bowel disease, but unfortunately I don’t have insurance coverage good enough to get the testing done to rule something like Colitis out.  IBS is another possibility [though it would be nice to rule out the other diseases to really arrive at that diagnosis], as the symptoms also reflect my own.  I don’t know really, but one way or the other I am going to try modifying the makeup of my diet to cope with possible bowel conditions.  Just not having all the problems with digestion would make eating a whole lot easier and impact my life less, even if it still was a full time job!

Slr-
2lbs a week is actually the recommended gain for someone not critically underweight.  During the severely underweight stages, or coming off of low levels of calories, the weight gain can be even faster because your body is so desperate for food and weight that it hangs on to every calorie.  If you stay consistent with increasing your calories your weight will actually slow down and plateu as your body feels healthy and gets used to having plenty of extra calories.  <-that’s a long ways off for you, by the looks of it.

Dana-
Ooh, meat is a toughie.  I was vegetarian in the past, and meat made me gag.  I started “teaching myself” to eat it for health reasons.  I went from hiding a slice or two of lunch meat in a loaded sandwhich, to adding a slice a day until I could eat a real sub.  Now I can eat meat straight, but I’m really picky about the texture.  What you could consider is maybe think of it as a temporary thing—to get you healthy.  Once your more stable you can decide to cut it out for other reasons and your health won’t be so apt to suffer consequences.

Agru-
I’m glad you didn’t take offense to my last post!  You’ve definitely made the real turnaround, from the “recovery game of life” to the “hey I want to see what’s out there beyond ED!”  My fear though is that in the excitement of that initial change, you might be falling into the “stuck” trap, since it is so much different from where you’ve been in the past.  But you don’t even know what it could be like to take it all the way!  That means continued moving forward, not sticking to the same meal plan and whatever that got you the initial change.

So for that pm ice cream—make it a full bowl, or at least enough ice cream to get you over 3000 next time!  Wouldn’t ED scream if you actually  had a 3000+ #? 
I mean, ED says “add extra calories just in case of the oil and stop at 3000 with every possible calorie accounted for.  But the ticket to YOUR life is breaking that sort of thinking and rule—if you dare shove it in the monster’s face!

Ack! I have more eating and packing to do myself.  I hope to check in later…but not get too behind in the crazy life either—impossible goal do ya think?!

absolutely.

I've maintained on 4000 cals during periods where I wasn't even doing activity--not even dumbell stuff, not one crunch.

Bottom line is figure out what it takes for you.

All the discussion of current activity level is actually backwards with how it works during recovery: activity at this point hinders and limits the metabolic rebound, as well as other physical recovery factors in regaining your health nand function.

Activity counteracts the metabolic rebound during recovery becayse the mechanism behind getting your metabolism working is to have a positive energy balance.: eating more than you would need to eat to maintain even with a faster metabolism.  So extra energy expenditure counteracts that.  Plus, if you take it to the extreme ED patients often get an extra rebound effect where their bodies get inefficient and lose crazy amounts of calories.

This is why it’s typically inpatients on bedrest that need over 4000 to gain, while outpatient others are gaining on 2-3000 [they haven’t been able to make the extreme intake + extreme restriction consistently without it being forced as it is inpatient].

Um, if I ate what these calculators say to maintain, I'd be dead by now.

Even adding 1000 calories to what it says fora "2lb gain per week" would be in calculation alone--not even taking me to maintanance levels in REALITY.

What matters is real life, not some calculation, right?

What are your goals, where do you want to be--work with that, not a calculator.

Agru-

worrying about the next step, or the end, is another key way ED keeps you trapped.

I promise it will work out--but only if you do what you need to now, now.

You really just need to focus on what you need to do for now.  That means your 2500 after the cookie.  That will be win-win for you.

You took a great stand against a life doomed to ED today--now don't let him take that victory away from you by causing you to "make up" for it by skimping later!

agru-

not a lot of time to respond because i'm on the go, but hoping to catch you before today starts--b/c who knows what it can have in store for you?!

1. Think of  list of foods you have never eaten/never eat.  write them down. dare to challenge that it "might" be ED and not your tastes--eat one every day.

Think snack aisle...junk food...pastries...cereals WITH your bagel at breakfast...stuff like that--i bet you can find something. ;)

I don't know how you got stuck on this whole "can't go above 2500 until I weigh" but it's a bunch of phooey. :-P ...another one of ED's crazy rules with no purpose except to hold you back!

You shouldn't weigh, and more will DEFINITELY get you some better results.  WITHOUT weighing!

Yes--have a combination of your "rules" for taking over your life.  The "retraining eating and building health" are you intake MINIMUMS [more always ONLY serves your better interest if your tough enough to set the standard higher], and maybe food group goals.  I think your challenge food group would be carbs maybe? 

Then have a list of foods you have never eaten, aren't "worth" your calories, or are scary in some way.  Try to eat at least one of those each day.

Next time you go to a party, make sure to have not just a taste, but a whole piece of the cake/pie, plate of chips, whatever it is.  Same gameplan as getting your calories up: don't think, just do.  THen the results and feeling right can kick in and pay off--and you get a life free of ED to boot!

Denying your hunger cues is ALWAYS a limit on your potential. It's saying "metabolism don't speed up, body you're not okay to be healthy, mind obsess over eating because you'll never be able to really fill the void and eat what you  need/want...and ED, go ahead and rule my life."

Your calories are the backbone--and right now it's a minimum to make sure you keep stepping forward.  If you have the "talent" and "speed" to run faster, win more, [think in terms of a race], don't slow down or limit yourself just for ED's sake!

Agru-part of overcoming ED is retraining yourself what you need and how to eat.  In that sense, you HAVE to be rigid for a long period of time, or you'll never get anywhere.  The ED rigidness is another story.  That's the part that doesn't allow you to eat certain foods [like you can eat X amount as long as it's "your foods"] or flex your schedule to eat out, eat chips at a party, and so on.  Changing up the latter is a big part of recovery.  But just "listening to your hunger" won't work until a lot more consistent "retraining" with how you need to eat has happened and health has been restored.

Dana-

Click on the middle  or third (?) link I posted earlier, there's a lot of overall information there, including g/lb.  .33g/lb is ideal.

The 1.5g/kg everyone keeps calculating for you is the UPPER limit, by the way--definitely pushing the strain and issues (also outlined in the articles) and about twice the idea amount of .8g/kg [.33g/lb or 33g for a 100lb person--so you'd even be okay at <30 but definitely no more than 50g].

The percent daily value is actually less useful in calculating protein needs than the one based on body weight.  Typically a diet should be about 60-70% carbs, 25-35% fat, and 8-12% protein, though.  20% is more based on the "protein fad" in our society lately, and not helpful or healthy for an athlete or anyone else.

Original Post by danamichael:

thanks sooooooo much everyone thats exactly what i wanted!  i hope the 1-1.5g per pound answer was right bc that would allot me 135g a day and that would be neat.  ill be safe with it and ill ask my nutritionist on tuesday and let you all know what she says as well!  my ideal weight is about 102-105 does that change my protein intake SANDRAKO?

 per KILOGRAM.  less than 1/2 of a gram per pound.