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Christians.....I have a Question?

OK, first let me put you in my picture.....

I was raised as a Christian until I was fourteen when I decided after some considerable thought that I no longer wanted to be a part of something that was and is in my eyes so hypocritical. As I sat there on my last ever day in church half listening to the apparent glory that is god, and looking at the people around me I just couldn't get it out of my head "what a bunch of hypocrites"! with their big flashy cars, posh houses, bragging about what they bought last week and how much it cost, standing outside damning them down the road for the way they live, what they wear etc. You do something bad, go to confession and tell a bloke who wasn't even there that you are sorry, he gives you 2 Hail-Marys and an Our Father and your saved....I'm not buying it.

What makes me laugh is that those who say they believe in god, think that that makes them a good person....why? I don't believe in god and I'm a much nicer person than some devout christains I know.

What makes you think that because you tell some person at your church that you are sorry for somethings that you are automatically saved?

How many of you can say in all honesty that you don't repeatedly break one or more of the.....

SEVEN DEADLY SINS (CARDINAL) for those not sure what they are (in short)....

1. Lust...excessive sexual desires.
2. Gluttony....over consumption of anything to the point of waste.
3. Greed....acquisition of wealth, anything obtained by disloyalty, betrayal. for personal gain.
4. Sloth...sin of sadness/despair, apathy, depression, failure to utilize ones talents/gifts.
5. Wrath...hatred, anger, denial of the truth to others/self, revenge, spite.
6. Envy...the desire to have something someone else has, to deny that person of having it because you want it.
7. Pride...the most deadly of all because it is the ultimate source from which all the others arise from. Excessive love of self!

It is these 7 things that turned me away, because nearly every single person in that church that day committed at least one of these on a daily basis, but that's OK because they confess to them every week....or do they? Then go out and do it all over again.

What is it that makes you believe that you can repeatedly commit these Deadly Sins and be continually forgiven for them, but the rest of us are damned?

*NOTE* This is an open topic for those for and against, everyone is entitled to their opinion and that opinion although open for debate must at all times be respected. Thank you.

 

i am quite intoxiacted and everyhinthig that i say may be a little funky bu ti just dont like the religion and i just donmt think its real. the end.

Original Post by carrie317:

Schnooder, I feel sorry for you. First of all, you don't know your facts. I assume that by saying "there was dinosaurs" (I assume you meant there were dinosaurs) you're implying that all Christians are of the young earth fundamentalist school, and that's simply not true. Many many Christians believe in evolution. And why do you say Christianity is a foolish thing? You say it because you have heard other people say it, and because you think it conflicts with science. Well believe it or not, many scientists, doctors, and other influential people in the scientific community believe in Christianity. And there doesn't have to be proof. If there were proof, what would be the point of faith?

And pgeorgian, I'm sorry that you haven't realized how incredible and amazing it is to have everything not be about you, and how freeing and invigorating it is to say, "It's not about me, it's about you. I don't need to be in control anymore."

Sorry if I came off a bit harsh in this one, I didn't mean to. I was just being honest.

chicken nuggets.

Yes I am talking about the Roman Catholic Church, but I have also been as a guest to the Mormon Church and a Christian fellowship Church, both of whom were all about how much of your hard earned money are you going to give them.

An old friend of mine lost her entire inheritance to the Mormon Church because the church persuaded her parents that that was the right thing to do.....for the church maybe they must have been rubbing their hands all the way to the bank.

And the Christian fellowship, which I have to say was just weird, tried to get a single parent to sign a bit of paper saying they would contribute half of his state benefit cheque to the church every week. The also had a faith healer night? everyone who went onto the stage to be healed had a miracle cure except the one person who really needed it, a little old lady who was in a lot of pain with her hip. I heard others say to her oh maybe it'll take a couple of days for the pain to go away....the pain did eventually go away but only when she got her hip replacement. I was told she never went back to the church after that. (Neither did I)

Just to clarify I didn't say that all Christians were hypocrites I said the ones in the church that day, and yes I did know them personally as it was a small village church where everyone knows your business.

Then of course there's the pope! God blessed his little cotton socks, that's for sure. Sits there in the Vatican, waited on hand and foot, surounded by gold, expensive works of art etc...whilst people in this world starve!

Carrie317...said "As soon as you accept him as your lord and saviour all you sins past, present and future are forgiven?

And roberma said "the point is that accepting christ as lord means he is in control it's not about you anymore...its about him..."

To reply to both of these....first for me forgiveness comes from within, if your conscience bothers you then you shouldn't have done it. To say that the lord is in control....does that not contradict the freedom he gave you to make your own path in this world?

Finally booster....yes you are right I was judging their actions, but I wasn't and don't claim to be a god fairing person.....they were.

No one has said anything to convince me that religion isn't in it's self hypocritical, all I still see are people trying to live up to a set of rules that in my opinion are totally impossible, and churches wanting you to give them your money (Greed). It appears to me that religion deliberately sets you up for failure!

For those who implied that I may be immature with my thoughts....I am quite mature thank you, just because I have questions about something to which no one can give me a reasonable enough answers to does not make a person immature.

 

 

You describe so many things that I find wrong with any religion - people who just go with the trend and consider themselves religious, while being hypocritical at the same time.

My thoughts are these:

Whatever religion you are, it should be for you and for you alone. The best way to avoid asking for forgiveness is to not sin in the first place! Of course, if you do sin (and I am sure everyone in this world has, no exceptions) then it is up to you to truly believe if you are sorry for your actions. There are some people who do sin and who really are sorry for what they did.. and of course there are those who don't care. In my eyes, only God can forgive you for your sins and not someone in a church who says 'you are forgiven my child' or whatever they say.

I am not a really religious Christian (I am actually Greek Orthodox and nowadays young Greeks are not too religious ;p) and I was always brought up with the ideas of doing good morally.. whether it be to protect yourself from hell or just to feel good about yourself (face it, everyone can be selfish at times!). My parents always told me the best way to go was to follow the 10 commandments (most don't apply to just Christians!). I try to be kind to people, I respect my parents, never cheated on my boyfriend and I've never killed anyone! I think that should cover about most things that people should do, no matter what religion they follow, or if they don't follow a religion. It's just pure common human sense.

My point is however, that your religion should be for you and no one else. I can't stress that enough. If you find other people who believe in the same things you do, then they're great people to hang out with!

Hope this doesn't veer off the subject too much, but I thought I'd share my opinions :)

agelades...I don't think you veered off topic at all.

I don't follow any religion since that last day I went to church. I am agnostic but verging more and more on the side of atheism. I believe that the god that people believe in is nothing more than your own conscience and it is that which determines if you are a good person or not, because for me conscience creates morals, which in turn creates your own beliefs in what's right and wrong. If people want to put a name to that process and call it god then that's their right, what I don't understand is why.

The thing about killing....I agree with you 99.9% but, I will probably be shot down in flames for this, but some times I think "an eye for an eye" is justified. Case in mind: A young child gets killed by a drunk hit and run driver, who was later caught, charged and released whilst waiting for his court date, he was going to claim diminished responsibility, the charge was reduced to "death by reckless driving" The guilty man got a couple of months in prison. The father of the little girl got a shotgun and killed the guy. Thankfully the jury came down on the fathers side and acquitted him he walked free from court.....I think the jury were right to do this.

Original Post by schnooder:

Original Post by davefiredancer19:

I believe you took mommakitty's comment out of context...she said TODAY that she hadnt done any of the above...which is entirely possible.

schnooder you must be a very angry young lady....I myself am not religious, but you must have some reason to be so angry and hateful. edit: looking back I see that you are the one who had that "ug the bible" thread.......

I am absolutely the opposite of how you perceive me. I love this world and I love my life and I love everyone. But I really really really can not stand that religion. When I feel strongly about something I will say it like I feel it. So you can say Im and angry hateful young lady but I am definately not. Christianity is the only thing I hate

Just because schnooder misread something does not make her Angry and Hateful..... Nor does loathing religion.

Well there is those kinds of people in every situation/group. I think that many do believe at least to some extent that they are better than others (non-believers) though. So that's probably where the 'nice to your face, but talk behind your back' comes from. My mom had trouble with people at the church we attended back when I was a kid. I guess the divorced-single-parent-mom didn't go over so well. Or maybe some of them like to pick on the weak (my moms very sensitive).

vicereine...I totally agree with what you said there, I saw/see that kind of thing all too often. Which is exactly my point.

i get accused of being condescending pretty regularly, but i have rarely seen anything on these boards as condescending as these comments:

Schnooder, I feel sorry for you.

And pgeorgian, I'm sorry that you haven't realized how incredible and amazing it is to have everything not be about you....

carrie317, maybe it's time for you to consider that there are ways to be a good human being that are not your ways.

*wonders why this thread hasn't been deleted*

...and how freeing and invigorating it is to say, "It's not about me, it's about you.  I don't need to be in control anymore."

just wanted to add that i do this all the time, only without the "you."  one of my most helpful life strategies is knowing what is and is not in my control.  for those things that are not in my control, however, i don't assume that some benevolent (or not) daddy-figure is looking out for my interests.  i know that the situation lies outside of my domain and that i have the capacity to deal with the outcome.

carrie, you make a lot of assumptions based on one tiny slice of information about me.  atheism and egocentrism are not the same thing.

Well, it seems like quite a few arguments are going on in this thread.  While I want to try to stay out of the fighting, there's something I feel that I must clarify.

Anndjoe, I understand your frustration completely.  It is very fair of you to wonder why simply spewing out everything bad you've done will relieve you of your sins.  I am assuming, however, that the church you attended was Catholic, because Orthodox Christian churches do not go to confession, nor do they confess to priests.

I myself am a Christian, and from purely my point of view, Catholicism can be a bit hypocritical at times.  I am not trying to offend any Catholics out there; I'm sure there have been hypocritical Christians as well.

My point is that confession to God is the only way (for Christians) to cleanse your sins, despite the fact that Catholics seem to teach otherwise.  I'm sorry for being so unclear and sponteneous, I just though I'd put my thoughts out there.

Okie

I know very good people of many different religions, and I know very good people with absolutely no religion at all. I think faith is a wonderful, beautiful thing but most Christians I know aren't about faith. They are about hedging their bets and being what I call "cookbook Christians" who do things just in case. It's when those people judge others that I fly off the handle, and they almost always do.

Trying to explain to a Christian that having my son baptized makes about as much sense as having a witch doctor come and perform a ceremonial dance is really a FUN conversation, let me tell you!

spiro, i wasn't baptized, and you can see how that turned out :/

my parents meant to; they just never got around to it.  obviously i was doomed from the start.

carrie317, maybe it's time for you to consider that there are ways to be a good human being that are not your ways.

pgeorgian, I know that there are many ways to be a good person without being a Christian.  And I didn't mean to imply that you were egocentric, and I'm sorry if I did.  I was just trying (and obviously failing) to explain what I've found to be an amazing aspect of my faith.  But, to be fair, were you assuming that because I'm a Christian, I assume that being a Christian is the only way to be a good person?

And anndjoe, I hate churches that are all about money as well.  At my church at home, my pastor always says before the offering that if you haven't accepted Christ, please don't give, because God wants your heart more than your money.

Spirochete, Christians that aren't about faith aren't very good Christians in my opinion (honestly, I don't see how they can consider themselves Christians at all).

There are clearly so many problems in the church today, but that's because the church is made up of men who are by nature imperfect.  My church at home did a whole series on "the church says sorry."  I can see why so many of you are turned off of Christianity.  You make many valid points.  But for me at least, my relationship with God surpasses any problems created by human imperfection.  

Oh, and I just want to thank everyone for this spirited debate.  I honestly enjoy conversations like this, as much as it frustrates me that I'm not more knowledgeable at times.  It's great when I find people who are capable of carrying on an actual intelligent debate about religion.

okay, carrie, enlighten me.  what did you mean by this comment?

And pgeorgian, I'm sorry that you haven't realized how incredible and amazing it is to have everything not be about you, and how freeing and invigorating it is to say, "It's not about me, it's about you.  I don't need to be in control anymore."

because it sure sounds like you're telling me that i'd be better off if i were like you.

Original Post by pgeorgian:

okay, carrie, enlighten me. what did you mean by this comment?

And pgeorgian, I'm sorry that you haven't realized how incredible and amazing it is to have everything not be about you, and how freeing and invigorating it is to say, "It's not about me, it's about you. I don't need to be in control anymore."

because it sure sounds like you're telling me that i'd be better off if i were like you.

Clearly that's wrong because  you'd be better off if you were like ME.

i thought i was like you....

True, but I bet you can be more like me if you tried a little harder