To cut or not to cut, that is the question.

So,I'm supposed to start my cutting/diet phase tomorrow.However, I haven't been going up in weight considerably for the last several weeks. I have been clocking in at 123.6 almost every time I've weighed for like 3 weeks now. My peak of this 6 weak "bulk" cycle was 124 or so. I started at 119. So, do I cut? I don't know... having access to the gym again 3 times a week-just since last week- means that I can really do heavy lifting instead of using barbells. It seems like a silly time to start cutting calories, when I could really push myself to make some strength gains doing deadlifts and squats. Common sense tells me not to cut, but another part of me wants to take down some fat and start over again once I'm a little leaner, plus there's the part of me that ones to stick to schedule.

Maybe a 2 or3 week cut, instead of a month long, then start over again?

What do you guys suggest?

My goal is recompositioning. I started the cycle at 119lbs, 20% BF, and looking pretty scrawny. I'd like to be about the same weight as that, but somewhere between 16-18 BF.

hmmm, well I do everything in sets of 50's. 50 days on, 50 days off (maintaining). But then again I weigh a lot more than you (I'm 135). I'm at about 19%-20% bf as well. What's your typical diet day like?

soy_vey, what i'm not sure about is whether you've been on a bulking cycle or not for the past 6 weeks.  you say you've been using non-gym dumbbells, and that makes me wonder what weights you've been using (most ppl don't have heavy weights at home).  at the gym, you'd be able to challenge your muscles by lifting heavier weights, thus making muscle gain possible.  if you've been gaining weight for 6 weeks but not lifting heavy weights, then you've been on a weight gain cycle but not a bulk cycle (and if you haven't really gained that much weight, then you haven't really been on a weight gain cycle either).

a bulk cycle would maximize your muscle gains by increasing calories and increasing the hypertrophic ranges of your lifting regimen (volume's pretty high, weight is medium to high, reps are medium).  check out this article from t-nation.

if you haven't been weight lifting seriously or doing tremendous cardio and you STILL haven't gained that much weight, then it's possible that you need to increase your calories to see results when you do take on a bulking program.  so if you haven't really "bulked," then you should give that a go.  and you might consider eating more, bec that's the only way to gain muscle.

Original Post by caloriecountingme:

soy_vey, what i'm not sure about is whether you've been on a bulking cycle or not for the past 6 weeks. you say you've been using non-gym dumbbells, and that makes me wonder what weights you've been using (most ppl don't have heavy weights at home). at the gym, you'd be able to challenge your muscles by lifting heavier weights, thus making muscle gain possible. if you've been gaining weight for 6 weeks but not lifting heavy weights, then you've been on a weight gain cycle but not a bulk cycle (and if you haven't really gained that much weight, then you haven't really been on a weight gain cycle either).

a bulk cycle would maximize your muscle gains by increasing calories and increasing the hypertrophic ranges of your lifting regimen (volume's pretty high, weight is medium to high, reps are medium). check out this article from t-nation.

if you haven't been weight lifting seriously or doing tremendous cardio and you STILL haven't gained that much weight, then it's possible that you need to increase your calories to see results when you do take on a bulking program. so if you haven't really "bulked," then you should give that a go. and you might consider eating more, bec that's the only way to gain muscle.

The DBs I have go up to 25 lbs, and I had been using them for things like DB squats, Sumo DB deadlifts, rows, weighted crunches, skull crushers, lunges, lat raises and other things that don't require tremendous weight in order to stimulate growth. I also threw in push ups and pull ups.

My intent was to gain about 5 lbs of muscle over 6 weeks, then lose some weight, then do a longer bulk cycle when I got back to school so I had access to the heavy machinery, per se. The reason I was even doing this in the first place was b/c I had hit a plateau and had done about as much as possible with beginner gains but still was at a higher BF than I desired. I figured I do a small cycle first, then do longer ones after I had leaned out a bit. I stopped doing cardio almost entirely during the cycle... only going on 1 run and a few hikes during the 6 weeks.

I understand the need to eat more, eat the right food, at the right time, and lift heavy in order to bulk. Like I've been saying in my journals(which I don't expect you to have been reading ) things hadn't been progressing as much as I would have liked. However, upon returning back to the gym after about a month off I had added 20 lbs to my squat weight, and upped my weights significantly in every other lift as well.

The question isn't really whether or not I want to do a bulk, or how to do it, b/c I still intend to. The question really is whether I should proceed with the 2 week or so cutting that I had planned on doing after 6 weeks before starting to bulk again.

soy_vey, though i understand what you're saying, i feel like i'm going to sort of repeat myself:  you haven't done a real "bulk" cycle, and therefore shouldn't move on to a cut cycle.  in order to gain some muscle, you'd need to work some big muscle groups:  legs and back and butt.  your pullups are great, and that's excellent.  but deadlifts w/25lb dumbbells (esp sumo deadlifts w/one 25lb dumbbell) are not gonna pack on any substantial muscle at your strength level.  i don't mean that you will only gain, or that you should only gain, muscle in your legs/back.  i mean that in order to stimulate the muscle growth hormones, your best bet is to engage muscles that will produce lots of those hormones. 

if you get to the gym and start using heavier weights and eating more, you'll start gaining muscle.  THEN you can go on a cutting cycle.  i understand the discomfort w/"bulking" and wanting to do it in short cycles.  but if you're going to do short cycles of bulking, then you should hit the weights hard for a couple weeks and then tone things down during your cutting cycle.  what do you think?

I understand, and I agree with you completely.

My only concern was that I start out leaner before I start a new bulk cycle. Since I was at 20% at 119lbs, and I've been told that people shouldn't really start bulking till they are very lean(13-16 for women, under 10 for men) I figured I'd take off a lf or two of fat before I started gaining again.

If you think that starting a bulk cycle at this BF isn't a bad idea, then maybe I'll just keep right on eating. 

I was at about 18% when i started to do my first bulk, this was done on the recommondation of my trainer because she said i would look too scrawny i'f i carried on cutting because i didn't have the muscle mass to carry off a lower body fat rating and look healthy. So i don't think it's always the case that you shouldn't bulk unless your already lean tbh i don't think it matters when you do it.

Secondly i agree it's very hard to engage your muscles enough using only small dumbells granted 25kg arn't that small but still you are very limited as to what you can do with them and it's difficult to engage large muscles like your legs with those weights so chances are this is the reason why you havn't seen much in the way of gains.

And lastly don't set your goals too high 5lb over 6 weeks was a very ambisious goal it's very difficult if not impossible to gain that much muscle in 6 weeks our body's simply don't work that way anything over 0.5lb a week is likely to be fat sadly.

Whats your bulking diet like?? how many calories are you taking in?? how much protien ?? Post it and we can try and help.

it is possible to bulk while losing a little fat, if you keep your diet super clean and eat the right foods, maybe it would be an idea to do a last 2 week bulk make a real push in the gym keep your diet 100% perfect for two weeks (its hard to keep a diet perfect all the time but 2 weeks insn't so long to make one big push for muscle gains)

Secondly don't be disheartened my bulk was only supposed to last 6weeks but my trainer has extended it till the end of october (adding 4 weeks) because i didn't make the gains she wanted before i started cutting, sadly it's just one of those things our bodys are fickle things at the best of times ... best to do what your body needs rather than sticking to a un-moving schedual.  

I'm eating between 1900-2500 kcals a day(approx), with the higher end being on my training days. 120-170 grams protein, anywhere between 45-70g fat, and the rest from carbs. I am a vegan, so I'm supplementing with rice protein and soy free protein shakes. My carb intake is primarily from veggies, whole grains(oatmeal in the morning), fruits and sprouted bread. I eat flax every day as well.

I'm eating around 6 times a day, small meals. I don't really eat any refined carbs at all.. and the closest thing I get to eating sugars is the apples and dried fruit I sometimes have.

Now that I have access to the gym and can really do good compound lifts, I'll probably up my intake considerably. I know my intake seems sort of low for a bulk cycle, but since I knew I wasn't challenging myself really hard I didn't want to be over eating and packing on fat. I did this for the first week or so of my cycle and suddenly have a squishy tummy again.

I think what I'll end up doing is continuing to lift hard and eat over for the next few weeks and see how it goes. Too bad I got sick right when I got back to school, so lifting will have to take the backseat for a few days till I'm feeling 100%.

Thanks for the advice, ladies.

Thing with bullking is you just need to keep adding the cal's untill your wieght starts to climb, you don't want it climbing super fast because that will indicate fat gain, and i know mentally it's quite hard to eat that much when your worried about fat gain.

However you might be suprised my wieght wouldn't even budge below 2,500cals even though most cals say i maintain on around 2000.

Bulking is the workout we do with our knife and fork...or say they say.