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why is being hedonistic considered bad..


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I m honestly not sure if I am a hedonist, parents I blame them. Brought me up with way too much ingrained guilt, conscience..But why is there always so much emphasis on sharing, giving back etc. Sure sometimes I get it, I would help but at times I feel they are just being lazy(ayn rand anyone). If someone makes millions, wins lottery, gets a grand bonus, can afford a jet or an island,can look like crap but still have young pretty things around, there is automatic backlash or I m sure he/she must be very unhappy somewhere. The only part I would not agree with, if it was at someone else's expense, but if thats your bliss then sure follow it..

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I'm sorry, I'm too busy being fed peeled grapes by my well-oiled man slaves whislt reclining on my solid gold bed to answer you. Maybe after I watch my panda bear fight and dip an elephant in gold I will find time.

As fen pointed out (I think), that's not how the mechanism works/thrives/survives.

Original Post by anony444:

But why is there always so much emphasis on sharing, giving back etc.


Are you really asking this?

Original Post by nomoreexcuses:

Original Post by anony444:

But why is there always so much emphasis on sharing, giving back etc.


Are you really asking this?

 To be fair, that's a question that I struggled with for years. In some people's minds, the answer isn't quite so obvious.

Sorry, I read 'hedonism' and think of a spoiled Roman emperor.

Ahem, anywho- f*** Ayn Rand, that mannish ****. The way I see it- ok, it is good to show charity, but I think- especially in Western Christian-entrenched culture, 'charity' often means being ridiculously selfless. Human nature is greedy, we like our stuff, and there is nothing wrong with that. It feels good to do what feels good, so long as it does not harm anyone else.

So in that same strain, couldn't you view other's view on their supposed 'hedonism' as jealousy and envy?

Original Post by fenrik_reinsdyr:

Sorry, I read 'hedonism' and think of a spoiled Roman emperor.

Ahem, anywho- f*** Ayn Rand, that mannish ****. The way I see it- ok, it is good to show charity, but I think- especially in Western Christian-entrenched culture, 'charity' often means being ridiculously selfless. Human nature is greedy, we like our stuff, and there is nothing wrong with that. It feels good to do what feels good, so long as it does not harm anyone else.

Exactly and why not

So in that same strain, couldn't you view other's view on their supposed 'hedonism' as jealousy and envy?

I dont get what you are saying here..

 

OK. Why is hedonism considered bad.

Well, let's start with the age-old concept of considering things to be bad. It used to be called sin.  These days, people say they have issues they're working on.

But wrath, gluttony, lust, pride, sloth, greed and envy were considered the 'worst' bad things or the deadly sins.

This is because they supposedly offended God.

Other sins, venial sins, would just offend your fellow humans.

Both kinds of sin would get you the death penalty back in the day.

Neither kind is illegal or carries formal punishment today. 

Some of them are now even celebrated.

Is there anything that the seven deadlies have in common, other than their place on that list?

 

One person's hedonism could be another person's misery.

 

Hedonism is defined as 'the pursuit of pleasure as a matter of ethical principle'. Altruism and hedonism aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, are they?

Original Post by kotov_syndrome:

One person's hedonism could be another person's misery.

 

Well according to Wiki (yes, I know) it can't be considered hedonism if it harms another.

Original Post by nomoreexcuses:

OK. Why is hedonism considered bad.

Well, let's start with the age-old concept of considering things to be bad. It used to be called sin.  These days, people say they have issues they're working on.

But wrath, gluttony, lust, pride, sloth, greed and envy were considered the 'worst' bad things or the deadly sins.

This is because they supposedly offended God.

Other sins, venial sins, would just offend your fellow humans.

Both kinds of sin would get you the death penalty back in the day.

Neither kind is illegal or carries formal punishment today. 

Some of them are now even celebrated.

Is there anything that the seven deadlies have in common, other than their place on that list?

 

 Again, because all of these things impeded the progression (or sometimes stagnation) of the mechanism that is society. Because "hedonism" traditionally referred to the pursuit of those things exclusively and stated that pleasure (usually physical [not just sex, though]) was the only thing worth seeking in life.

Original Post by kathygator:

Original Post by kotov_syndrome:

One person's hedonism could be another person's misery.

 

Well according to Wiki (yes, I know) it can't be considered hedonism if it harms another.

 I meant more in the sense of what one person considered hedonism (hanging out, eating peeled grapes all day), another person would consider abhorrent.

If we all acted in purely hedonistic ways, I'm pretty sure we would all suffer. How would we get food without someone (us or others) toiling to make it?

Fenny can't eat her grapes if someone doesn't grow them, pick them, and peel them.

Ah. Distinction noted, Kotov.

I don't think living completely hedonistically is realistic, I just like being able to do what feels good, and it harm none.

Original Post by amethystgirl:

If we all acted in purely hedonistic ways, I'm pretty sure we would all suffer. How would we get food without someone (us or others) toiling to make it?

Fenny can't eat her grapes if someone doesn't grow them, pick them, and peel them.

 Of course.. peeling grapes is funny btw, thanks for putting that in my head for the whole day now..

Pursuit of pleasure could be anything. Reading or soaking in a tub, who knows maybe even toiling in fields? Alcoholics or workaholics both are indulging themselves.. At least I think so..

Original Post by anony444:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

If we all acted in purely hedonistic ways, I'm pretty sure we would all suffer. How would we get food without someone (us or others) toiling to make it?

Fenny can't eat her grapes if someone doesn't grow them, pick them, and peel them.

 Of course.. peeling grapes is funny btw, thanks for putting that in my head for the whole day now..

Pursuit of pleasure could be anything. Reading or soaking in a tub, who knows maybe even toiling in fields? Alcoholics or workaholics both are indulging themselves.. At least I think so..

 That's where your definition of hedonism differs from the traditional definition. You're basically describing a "live and let live" attitude or the pursuit of happiness or whatever you want to call it. Since we're all just trying to carve a little contentment out of life, by your reckoning, we'd all be hedonists. :P There's nothing at all with doing what you feel you need to do to be happy, to the exclusion of harming others. That isn't hedonism. That's life.

Do you know any alcoholics?

Or are you talking about heavy drinkers? People who can stop if they want to.

People who have addictions don't tend to be super happy people.

:/

Original Post by kotov_syndrome:

Original Post by anony444:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

If we all acted in purely hedonistic ways, I'm pretty sure we would all suffer. How would we get food without someone (us or others) toiling to make it?

Fenny can't eat her grapes if someone doesn't grow them, pick them, and peel them.

 Of course.. peeling grapes is funny btw, thanks for putting that in my head for the whole day now..

Pursuit of pleasure could be anything. Reading or soaking in a tub, who knows maybe even toiling in fields? Alcoholics or workaholics both are indulging themselves.. At least I think so..

 That's where your definition of hedonism differs from the traditional definition. You're basically describing a "live and let live" attitude or the pursuit of happiness or whatever you want to call it. Since we're all just trying to carve a little contentment out of life, by your reckoning, we'd all be hedonists. :P There's nothing at all with doing what you feel you need to do to be happy, to the exclusion of harming others. That isn't hedonism. That's life.

 I guess, I m not very good with traditional definitions..

Original Post by nomoreexcuses:

Is there anything that the seven deadlies have in common, other than their place on that list?

 

 as they say, at the root of all sins is pride.

Original Post by nomoreexcuses:

Do you know any alcoholics?

Or are you talking about heavy drinkers? People who can stop if they want to.

People who have addictions don't tend to be super happy people.

:/

Very true.  And a good chunk of the people I know who I'd call "workaholics" hate their jobs.

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