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Being Vegan and the Military


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Ok, so I am seriously thinking i might join the Army if I do not get offered a job as a civilian contractor again in the near future. If I join, I might have to wear leather boots and that is one of the main reasons I am hesitating. Would I be a "bad" vegan if I did this?
Edited Aug 15 2008 05:17 by smw
Reason: Moved to more appropriate forum for the political direction it's gone in.
79 Replies (last)

i'm pretty sure this is a joke.

It isn't.

Only you can decide how you feel about being a vegan. Personally, I believe that being vegetarian or vegan applies to not using animal products when possible, and striving to avoid them, but if it is unrealistic to avoid them, all or nothing is a bad mentality--all might be ideal, but some is better than nothing. I do not wear leather and will not buy leather, but when my wallet broke I made do temporarily with a leather wallet that used to be my father's because I could not undo the animal's death and the item's purchase by doing without a wallet.

BUT

Do you really think you can eat vegan in the military? No way. You'll be fed whatever they're feeding you. You won't get much choice, and MREs can be vegetarian, but not vegan. If your decision whether or not to join the military is going to be influenced by your desire to be vegan, the military isn't going to work out.

http://www.vegparadise.com/news31.html

If wearing leather boots is an issue then the chances are highly unlikely the US Army will make any exceptions for you not to wear Army boots.  I can say this from 31 years of experience with the Army (both from 23 yrs active as well as 8 years DoD civilian).  If that is a deal breaker I would look towards another branch of service that may not have that requirement.

As for being a "vegan" an earlier post said it correctly the Army does offer vegetarian and Kosher MREs.  Again my experience as a leader this would be a challenge to provide adequate nourishment beyond the MRE side because feeding soldiers from a fixed facility, field kitchen and an MRE is totally different.  You would likely not be totally satisfied with the accommodations if you try to strictly enforce that requirement.

Just my 2 cents...

Original Post by devotchka613:

It isn't.

haha. if you are seriously thinking of joining the army you should probably be think ing about a bit more than wearing leather boots. i don't know what it is you think the army does but a bit more gruesome than wearing some boots made from leather.

Dave,


Aren't many MREs fortified with butter for the extra calories or is that a myth? I'm told that's why lactose intolerant individuals can't join.

Devotchka (nice name btw, singing in the rain today?):

I don't think you'd be a bad vegan. Just don't join the Army on a whim, and think it through. Remember that the contract is 8 years of your life total. If you try your best within limitations to be the best vegan you can be, provided you can tolerate leather/MREs that are given TO you not chosen BY you, then go for it.


Also don't think I'm trying to tell you not to join, the entire reason I'm losing weight is to join. Just don't join on a whim and research MOSs and enlistment contract options before you go and sign anything.

 

Also, killing people, or being a part of an institution that kills people doesn't seem very vegan to me.  You won't eat a cow, but you'll participate in the murdering of brown people?  How does that make sense?

The military is equal opportunity, we'll kill anybody!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA oooh, I'm funny!

But seriously, you're going to be so stressed out during basic training and deployments that you'll just be worrying about getting ANYTHING to eat! they do have veggies, noodles, fruit, dry cereal and peanut butter, so you can try and keep to a vegan lifestyle, but it is going to be real hard. Try the Air Force if you don't want to wear leather boots. We just switched to boots made out of canvas. A pain to keep clean, but no leather!

I'm with todeinotaton on this one.
Original Post by when_i_fly_and_look_down:

Original Post by devotchka613:

It isn't.

haha. if you are seriously thinking of joining the army you should probably be think ing about a bit more than wearing leather boots. i don't know what it is you think the army does but a bit more gruesome than wearing some boots made from leather.

What is that supposed to mean? I know what the Army does. And yes, silly as it may sound the boots were my main concern. I've been working with the military for the past 9 years off and on just never joined. Anyway, I got the job offer I was hoping for so I'm not joining the military but I'll be working with them. Thanks for all the input everyone. Sorry if it was a stupid post, but it was important to me.
Original Post by devotchka613:

silly as it may sound the boots were my main concern

It doesn't sound silly.  It sounds disgusting and hyporcritical to be concerned about leather boots while you're killing people.

Being in the army doesn't make you an automatic killer. Women especially usually don't even end up in combat. And just because I don't think like you doesn't mean i'm disgusting and hypocritical. I didn't come on here for a fight so back the hell off. And it's in no way hypocritical, you don't know me or what I stand for, quit acting like you do. And for the record the jobs I was going to go for has nothing to do with killing.

I was gonna' say just because someone doesn't like wrapping their feet in dead animal doesn't mean they don't mind being a part of the Army.

One shouldn't make assumptions but everyone has a variety of reasons for doing the things they do... Nowhere does it say under the definition of "vegan" that you have to abhor ALL death and have the same moral standards as every other vegan. You just have to shy away from animal products, which is a decision made either for your personal health or morals (for instance, the over using of otherwise inhabitable land to raise livestock).

Devotchka: What MOS were you looking at? :)

Original Post by devotchka613:

Original Post by when_i_fly_and_look_down:

Original Post by devotchka613:

It isn't.

haha. if you are seriously thinking of joining the army you should probably be think ing about a bit more than wearing leather boots. i don't know what it is you think the army does but a bit more gruesome than wearing some boots made from leather.

 

What is that supposed to mean? I know what the Army does. And yes, silly as it may sound the boots were my main concern. I've been working with the military for the past 9 years off and on just never joined. Anyway, I got the job offer I was hoping for so I'm not joining the military but I'll be working with them. Thanks for all the input everyone. Sorry if it was a stupid post, but it was important to me.

if you are working with the army then you are working for the army and you are helping the army and what the army does is kill people. and what our army does is kill a lot of innocent people.

i'm sorry but there is no way around it. it doesn't matter if your not pulling the trigger. it might seem better to you because you don't have to kill anyone directly but you will be helping toward that cause.

I know what the army does, but that is not what I was asking about. I simply asked about leather boots. Yes, I care about innocent people, but I care about innocent animals just as much if not more (i don't care if you think I am crazy, that's just the way I am). Like I said anyway, i'm NOT joining any military, I got an offer and will be working with the army but I guess you could say I will be "indirectly" killing people just by doing that. I wasn't starting this out talking about people here, it was about animals, veganism and the military. Not Animals, veganism, people and the military. If you say I am helping toward the Army's cause then I am proud to be doing it. And I am even prouder of helping toward the animals' cause.

Pezzle, as far as MOSs, I can't remember all of them but the ones I remember are Unit Supply Technician, Veterinary Assistant, IT and Mortuary Science I believe.
Original Post by devotchka613:

but I guess you could say I will be "indirectly" killing people just by doing that.
________________________
Pezzle, as far as MOSs, I can't remember all of them but the ones I remember are Unit Supply Technician, Veterinary Assistant, IT and Mortuary Science I believe.

I am looking at 74D Chem :D

And on that note, according to everyone's "if you are a part of the Army you have blood on your hands regardless of MOS" argument, we are all indirectly killing people by paying taxes, which then go to our semi-substantial military budget. So let's stop that line of logic right in its tracks.

There's also a difference between the abuse of domesticated livestock and animals and the killing of innocents. Innocent civilians are swept up in a fray and frenzy of war, we do not target innocent people for the hell of it. I don't know where people come up with that argument.

 

Original Post by when_i_fly_and_look_down:

Original Post by devotchka613:

Original Post by when_i_fly_and_look_down:

Original Post by devotchka613:

It isn't.

haha. if you are seriously thinking of joining the army you should probably be think ing about a bit more than wearing leather boots. i don't know what it is you think the army does but a bit more gruesome than wearing some boots made from leather.

 

What is that supposed to mean? I know what the Army does. And yes, silly as it may sound the boots were my main concern. I've been working with the military for the past 9 years off and on just never joined. Anyway, I got the job offer I was hoping for so I'm not joining the military but I'll be working with them. Thanks for all the input everyone. Sorry if it was a stupid post, but it was important to me.

if you are working with the army then you are working for the army and you are helping the army and what the army does is kill people. and what our army does is kill a lot of innocent people.

i'm sorry but there is no way around it. it doesn't matter if your not pulling the trigger. it might seem better to you because you don't have to kill anyone directly but you will be helping toward that cause.

 Actually, the military is for the defense of OUR COUNTRY AND OUR RIGHTS! If that means killing an enemy in the course of our duties, then so be it.

There is somthing called LOAC, Law of Armed Conflict. In this directive,  it has what the US military can and cannot do in a war or armed conflict. It also has guidlines for colatiral damage, and what are legal targets. Our enemies right now do not follow LOAC, nor to they follow any sort of Geniva accord or treaty. Even though our enemies right now will torture, beat, rape or behead ANYONE that they get their hands on, we do not. If we do, the military memeber is prosecuted.

War is an wretched, horrid thing. No one is saying anything else. No one hates fighting more than a soldier. Because of this, our military does everything in our power to negate or lessen the civilian casualties. Through education, training and weapon upgrades, we continiously strive to lessen the impact of our actions. But, of course, all the good and positive things that we do in Iraq and Afghanistan is never reported. By show of "hands" how many people know that the US Air Force is training pilots and maintainers, as well as supplying air craft to the Iraqi Air Force? That we have donated/built/upkeep numerous schools?

Original Post by devotchka613:

Being in the army doesn't make you an automatic killer. Women especially usually don't even end up in combat. And just because I don't think like you doesn't mean i'm disgusting and hypocritical. I didn't come on here for a fight so back the hell off. And it's in no way hypocritical, you don't know me or what I stand for, quit acting like you do. And for the record the jobs I was going to go for has nothing to do with killing.

If you're involved with the US military you are involved in murder, whether you're pulling the trigger or not.  You're right.  I don't know you or what you stand for, but I do know that the military kills people and so do you.

You people are so brainwashed it's disgusting.

#19  
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Take it from someone who is former ARMY. If you have to ask the question, you don't belong in the Army. I'm not being cruel or harsh, but, being a vegan in the military is nearly impossible -- not to mention the leather bots.

Original Post by todeinotaton:

Original Post by devotchka613:

Being in the army doesn't make you an automatic killer. Women especially usually don't even end up in combat. And just because I don't think like you doesn't mean i'm disgusting and hypocritical. I didn't come on here for a fight so back the hell off. And it's in no way hypocritical, you don't know me or what I stand for, quit acting like you do. And for the record the jobs I was going to go for has nothing to do with killing.

If you're involved with the US military you are involved in murder, whether you're pulling the trigger or not. You're right. I don't know you or what you stand for, but I do know that the military kills people and so do you.

You people are so brainwashed it's disgusting.

You are quite judgmental, and elitist. Just imagine what a shambles we'd be without the Armed Forces in place.

Furthermore, is it really murder when the enemy is armed and in many cases shooting first? Is it somehow not murder when they setup roadside IEDs and blow our convoys away? Was it not murder when they flew planes into our World Trade Center?

If you reference the "Loose Change" video at all, I'm leaving this conversation.

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