This girl has more courage than I ever could!

So, there's a new contender to the Miss UK title, 17 year old Chloe who is anything but a size zero model. She's out there to tell people to be happy with their bodies, which I think is a good message overall. Now, I think it takes a lot of self-esteem and courage to put yourself out there for the media to devour when you know that anything over an American size 0 is considered a cow. But I feel terrible for her because of all the horrible comments people are making to her below.

The question addressed by these "commentators" (who should know better than to post these things when someone has put themselves out there) is:

Has there been too much alteration to the idea of "curvy" versus "overweight"?

What do you guys think?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/article s/showbiz/showbiznews.html?in_article_id=5527 92&in_page_id=1773&ico=Homepage&i cl=TabModule&icc=picbox&ct=5

If she is a UK 16 she's actually a 14 here in the US.  I agree she is pretty and that's great that she can be okay with herself.  Though I'm not sure if she is because I do think she is lying about her stats.  Unless these just happen to be pictures that don't do her justice at all.  I think she looks good but I don't think she's being honest. She looks bigger and heavier then what she claims.  Which to me means she really isn't okay with herself.   Also I understand the concern about "not promoting obesity" and the fine line between that and poor self esteem.  I just worry about health problems she may have in the future.  If she's healthy great!!  I just worrry as she ages her health will decline.  I can say that I got to the point that I didn't have the perfect body at all but was 100% okay with it.  Until my health started to decline.  PCOS, arthritis, etc.  So now I still like myself I just tell myself "If I really like myself, I'll do what's healthy for my body." (Doesn't always work but again I think its hard to stay motivated but not beat yourself up)

I don't think anyone should attack this girl or her looks but maybe question her health/future health.  I know that there are healthy people out there who might be considered overweight but I think there ar far more who are overweight and not healthy.  I'm including myself in that group too.

umm...well i also find it hard to believe she is 176 pounds....maybe I am wrong along with the others.  As far as sizes go maybe she is right on...gosh I do not know what to think.   I do know she does kinda look like Chloe on days of our lives.  I think she is fine the way she is... the suit is not that flattering although.  I weigh about 20 piunds less and you would not catch me dead in that suit! Good for her anyway, and I do not believe she is promoting obesity!

wow! this topic really took off!

I have to agree with feanor, they should have put her in flattering clothes, or a more flattering bathing suit! The photographer should have known better.

I think that techraven is right. She doesn't look healthy. I know that we keep saying that "normal women" aren't a size zero, but normality isn't a size UK16 US14 either, sorry, but society has gone on this entire spin of the "average woman" is a size 10, then 12 etc.: Well what does THAT tell you?

 I agree that some women have bodies that just like it one way and don't change, and if she's healthy as she says she is, then good on her! She still has more guts than I would.

I've always been a thin person even before my ED. That's why I find it difficult to believe that she healthy at that weight. Surely if she were eating properly she'd be thinner?! I know my perception is slightly warped but I don't view that as the happy healthy alternative to skinnyness...

i believe the weight might be right, she is quite tall and some people are that heavy (my cousin is about 170 pounds, about her height, and the looks actually thinner than this woman).

i do not think she looks extremely pretty, but, as with the dove campaign, it might be helpful if more bodies like this were commonly in the media

I think a lot of overweight women are pretty. Their faces often have nice skin and are wrinkle-free.

I think this woman has a pretty face, but her body does not look healthy. Some women can look stunning if they are a bit overweight where they still have a smooth, but larger, body. She, on the other hand, collects a lot of fat around her stomach area - this is not healthy at all.

Oh em gee...

Venus is so disgustingly fat...

http://www.pbase.com/emi_fiend/image/68508536

No one could ever possibly find her attractive. Look at the pudge around her mid section.

Hear hear hgie....I am a little confused about the use of the word "healthy" here. Since when did it become unhealthy for women to have a soft belly? Some people are saying, oh it's not healthy to have fat around your midsection, but as another poster pointed out, the kind of fat they are referring to is fat around the organs which shows up on the outside as a round, hard, extended chest/waist. NOT the kind of Chloe here is sporting, which is simply a softness. She doesn't even have a fat roll, I would kill to not have a fat roll.

I think it's really more a question of aesthetics. And this, generally, is dictated by our time. What we see as overweight changes dramatically through the ages. We can't possibly know if she is "unhealthy" or not, there is nothing I see here to indicate anything of that kind....I mean besides the misguided attampts to blame her belly fat, what do people mean by "looks unhealthy"?

If you think she looks bad, well that's your opinion. But I think it's unfair to justify your opinion (which is really unnecessary, you have a right to it) by saying it's because she's unhealthy. We can't know that.

Also, because this has really been bugging me, I did a little research on the whole weight issue. It actually IS possible she is only 176 lbs, because she is barely 17. Bone density continues to increase until about 30 yrs old, so at 17, her bones are lighter than a fully grown adult, so more of that weight is fat rather than bone weight. Make sense?

And, one last thing then I will shut up...where ARE all the medium-size girls anyway? Why must we be comparing a size 16 to a size 0 in our arguments?? Where are the size 10s, size 12s in our media examples? Why do I hear nothing but crickets?

Techraven:

My best friend is 5'10 and 175lbs, she wears a 12 (wide hips but flat defined stomach and you can EASILY see her hip bones) and looks fabulous in a bikini.  She's healthy and at a good weight for her height.  There is no way this girls stats are correct.

I also don't want to say she looks gross or obese, I just think that if they told us she weighs 235 then we would think, wow she looks good for her size.  However If she really is 175ish and 5'10 she does not look good or fit for her weight and height.  I think that's the problem, it's not that she looks HUGE or OBESE, it's that she looks big for her height/weight and what I thinke 'we' are trying to say is that if she really worked out as much as she says she does then she would look much smaller and more toned.

Check out my pictures. Before you puke at my unattractive size and all my fat, remember this: I eat a diet primarily of fruits/vegetables, with a bit of dairy, beans, and nuts. On the rare occasion I eat grains, it's whole grains, and I don't eat sugar or trans fats. I prepare almost all of my food (I obviously don't make my own butter or tofu). I also work out 4-5 times a week.

 I'd love to look like her.

http://www.pbase.com/emi_fiend/image/68508536

vs

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/article s/showbiz/showbiznews.html?in_article_id=5527 92

...

what?

Hip to Waist Ratio:
It was found that a women is most attractive when her hip to waist ratio is 70% (for you guys out there, the ideal is 90%). Studies continue that “interest is lost” (nice way to put it, huh) when the ratio exceeds 80%. Interesting; this study used photos of Playboy models.

The mode size of a Playboy model is 34-24-36, weight is 110, and height is 5′7″.
Waist-Hip Ratio of .7 and BMI of 17.8.

Beauty icons including Marilyn Monroe, Alessandra Ambrosio, Sophia Loren, Kate Moss, and even Venus de Milo all have ratios around 70%. Notice they have significantly different weights.

In Bottecilli's version of venus, 1400's she nearly has a six pack.

A six pack? You've got to be kidding me.

How about this Venus, Venus of Dolní Věstonice...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Vestonicka_venuse.jpg

And how about Polynesian cultures that treasure the cushion pushin' pleasures?

My waist to hip ratio is right at 80%. I'm way bigger than Chloe. Waist to hip ratio has nothing to do with size and everything to do with how small your waist is compared to your hips. That's why they call it a waist to hip ratio. I'd love to know her measurements, I'm not the betting type but I bet it's higher than 70%.

I'm HOT. SMOKING HOT. And I'm bigger than this girl. Attention from the men has never been in short supply in my life.

Just because you were a fat man does not mean you have any idea what it's like to be a fat woman. You have absolutely NO idea. It would be awesome if you would keep your mouth shut on this topic. There are a lot of big women here who have NO self esteem because society tells them they can't be sexy/beautiful/attractive. Big women are completely devalued in our current society, since so much of a woman's sense of worth in our current society is derived from outward appearances. You don't seem to understand that. Men who are overweight are "okay" -- they can define themeselves by other standards -- he's sweet, he's a great father, he's an amazing business person, he is funny, etc.

And your presence in this thread has been incredibly negative and destructive to what little ego boost some women may get when they see a BEAUTIFUL young lady that they can relate to doing well in a beauty pageant.

hgielrehtaeh, I give you a virtual high five.

And another thing...

I have a real hard time losing weight and being movtivated when I feel like crap about how I look. What's the point of doing something nice for myself if I'm worthless?

It's only when I feel good about how I look that I am motivated to do good things for me, like lose weight in a HEALTHY way.

This whole you're-a-big-woman-so-you're-ugly-and-therefo re-worthless-in-our-society is the reason that young girls are starving themselves thin instead of doing weight training and eating a healthy diet full of the nutrients they need.

I know a woman that lost nearly 100 pounds. She's not stronger or that much healthier -- she eats unhealthy foods and doesn't work out. But, I suppose that since she "looks healthy" to you, that means she's immune to a heart attack. Geesh.

*opens a magazine to stare at nothing but guys with 5% bodyfat and enormous ammounts of muscle*
*continues to the next page to see ads for 'male enlargement'*
*finds an ad for weightloss*
*finds another ad for muscle gain*
*finds an ad stating he is to small to please a woman*
*finds another 6'0, 5% bodyfat male*

Regardless this has goten way off topic, you're the one that mentioned venus, most specifically Venus De Milo who is quite fit, and Boteccili's venus is again quite fit...

I still hold to my statement, this UK model looks to be far from healthy, nothing wrong with larger women. But I honestly doubt with how untoned she looks she is healthy.

Well I think she looks overweight too. She is obvioulsy a very pretty girl. She isnt THAT bad as some people say. But I think she does look more around 200, but who knows, maybe she is 176,  some people just wear their weight badly. But I'm 5'10 too and I know that at 176 i didnt look anything remotely like that, and I have a small-to-medium frame.

Just for techraven, at 5'10-160-size 10 or 12, My butt is a whopping 44 inches (good birthing hips as my grandma says lol), and my waiste is 31, and I wear a 38C (medium tshirt). I dont know if thats average or what. I consider myself overweight just cuz I know I'm flabby in areas I ought not be and when I sit down after a big dinner I can probably rest a coke on my fat belly lol. But thats just my experience as a tall girl. Ps. I think folks are bein a smidge harsh on ya. I didnt find anything wrong with what ya said. :)--and not just cuz ur good looking lol.

Original Post by techraven:

*opens a magazine to stare at nothing but guys with 5% bodyfat and enormous ammounts of muscle*
*continues to the next page to see ads for 'male enlargement'*
*finds an ad for weightloss*
*finds another ad for muscle gain*
*finds an ad stating he is to small to please a woman*
*finds another 6'0, 5% bodyfat male*

Regardless this has goten way off topic, you're the one that mentioned venus, most specifically Venus De Milo who is quite fit, and Boteccili's venus is again quite fit...

I still hold to my statement, this UK model looks to be far from healthy, nothing wrong with larger women. But I honestly doubt with how untoned she looks she is healthy.

 *turns on the tv*

King of Queens -- fat man, hot wife
Simpsons -- fat man, thin wife
Drew Carry show -- Drew, fat, dates hot women; that big woman has bad makeup and is annoying and "unlovable"

Shall I continue to change the channel?

And what magazine are you looking in? Muscle Fitness? Because, duh, you'll find fit men in fitness magazines.

How did I know you where going to say KoQ?
Didn't guess the simpsons one tho.
I know more real life fat women, skinny guys then I know fat guys, skinny women.. Maybe just my selective group... Although my uncle falls into the fat guy skinny woman category..

I didn't say the 'intolerance' is on both sides... cause it is... I don't agree with size 0 being 'needed'.

And no, actually I was looking at PC World... But well, I read my gf's cosmo, and I don't find a lack of buff uber fit guys in that either...