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Kill Gays?

Well, I was watching the BBC and they started speaking about this.

I have to admit, I was a little shocked! Such horrible things against people just because they are gay! I also found out some gay killings have been happening in Israel (no suprise, Jews are anti-gay).

But then, I started wondering if those kinds of things could ever happen in America…

So, I searched a little more and found this. It seems, yes, Americans are capable of this too.

 Some more research turned up that gay killings are up 28 percent this year.

 Why? Because of people who support the separation and anti-gay agenda in our society.

We deny them equal rights because they are gay.

We still fire them because they are gay.

We make fun of them because they are gay.

We tell our children they are immoral and wrong because they are gay.

We kill them because they are gay.

Is it a mystery these killings are still happening?

I guess I don’t understand why seemingly decent people are supporting this line of violence against others? I know from the other threads that there are a lot of “anti-gay” people on this forum even. Who feel we need to deny gays the same rights in marriage.

 Yea, you might not be pulling the trigger on them…or torturing them… or actually handing them the pink slips. But you are supporting ALL of those things by saying gay people shouldn’t be equal and are wrong for what they do. You send the message loud and clear to everyone around you (your children?) that gay is bad. They just take the next logical step and do the killing or firing or alienation of “bad people”.

 So, I’m curious, for those that appose equality for gay people… how are you “ok” with supporting this hate against gay people? How do you justify it in your mind? Do you think “oh, well we are ONLY talking about marriage, I don’t want any of that other stuff” ?

 Yet, I see people here saying they “personally believe homosexuality is wrong”. I hate to tell you, but that’s not about marriage. That’s saying these people are bad or wrong for what they do (and again, this is supporting all the murder and firing and everything else that is happening to these people).

If you don't believe me, hang around some kids for an hour or two. Count how many times they use "gay" as meaning things are bad or wrong. Then tell me society isn't teaching them to hate homosexuals...and making the path clear for them to continue this line of violence.

So, anti-gay people here on the forum (and I KNOW you are here)... can you explain it?

Human Rights Watch (HRW) a fantastic organization dedicated to human rights everywhere for everyone. please donate!!! please support them!!!

HRW LGBT rights page

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I don't like my boss. However, I don't want him murdered or fired from his job....

Original Post by loriklorik:

Is it a mystery these killings are still happening?

I guess I don’t understand why seemingly decent people are supporting this line of violence against others?

Which "seemingly decent" people are you referring to? Soilders? Iraqi militiamen? Small town, small minded, bible belt americans?

Decent people are tolerant and open minded.

I work in a homosexual friendly work place.  I knew my manager before he came out and he is a one of my best managers ever.  One of my other other managers is a flamboyant homosexual and he is one of the greatest guys to go and party with.
Many of the girls are lesbians and do not hide it either.  One just married her partner last month.

Not being happy with who you are is wrong. 
BACs who come up to people and tell them that they are going to hell are wrong. 

I work right across from a 'gay' bar and they come in after the bar closes.  They are much more friendly and a lot more fun then the straight customers.  Yet the bar is one of the most picked on bars by the cops in the city.  Not warrented at all considering that the other bars downtown have shootings and stabbings almost every other week.

I believe that everyone should mind their own business and put their own lives in order before they start hating people for not being heterosexual. 

Love is hard to find nowadays and if you can find it all jump at the chance.

Disclaimer, I am not a lesbian, but I play one at work because I get better tips from the homosexuals then the hetrosexuals.

Original Post by spoiled_candy:

Love is hard to find nowadays and if you can find it all jump at the chance.

Disclaimer, I am not a lesbian, but I play one at work because I get better tips from the homosexuals then the hetrosexuals.

LMAO ((candy)) 

Original Post by misscherryjane:

Which "seemingly decent" people are you referring to?

 Every person who voted against gay marriage rights (to begin with).

Original Post by spoiled_candy:

I believe that everyone should mind their own business and put their own lives in order before they start hating people for not being heterosexual. 

Love is hard to find nowadays and if you can find it all jump at the chance.

^ I concur with this.

Don't be a Hater.

Once at my little brother's t-ball practice, they were having a bit of a break (they were like 7 at the time) and just running around and playing. I was doing some HW and I look up to see the coach's wife walking towards me to tell me, in a very serious voice, that one of the other boys was chasing some of the others (my little bro included) threatening to kiss them. She goes on and on like this is horrible and is talking about speaking to kissing boys mom, blah, blah, blah.

I look over, they all look like they're having good fun to me, when one boy on the outskirts starts yelling that he'll hit the kid with a bat if he kisses him and he picks one up. I look back at wonder-wife, all serious, put my hand on her shoulder, and tell her I'll take care of it. I walk up to the boys, point my finger at the kid with the bat and say "you better put that bat down right down, and if I ever see or hear you threaten someone with it again, you will be kicked off this team and I'll tell your dad." Then I got my little brother and left.

I was so appalled that everyone was in a homo-phobic fuss about a bunch of 8-year olds.  I can't wait to get out of the bible-belt.

You know, Lorik...

I hate to defend the small-minded, but I think there's a big difference between those who are against homosexuality or gay marriage and those that beat or kill homosexuals.

Whether we like it or not, people have a legitimate right to decide whether or not they are for or against homosexuality, and whether or not they support gay marriage. It isn't up to you or I or anyone to tell them what they should believe, just as it isn't up to them to tell you what YOU should believe.

I'm not sure that the fact that there are a.. 50% or so of Americans that are against gay marriage has anything to do with the psychotics that think it's OK to kill. These people are psychotics. They'd be psychotics no matter what they believed. The whole homosexuality thing is an excuse. They could easily be the guy who's gotten dumped by women and goes into a women's gym to kill as many as he can, or the kid that's been bullied and so takes a gun into school and shoots as many kids as he can. The reason is as much excuse to kill as any sort of real reason at all.

So, yes, I do wish people were a bit less judgemental, a bit less quick to damn others for not living the sort of life that they may view as "good" or "righteous", but I don't think it's fair to blame them for the increased death in homosexuals, since for most people it ends with their beliefs.

Original Post by loriklorik:

I have to admit, I was a little shocked! Such horrible things against people just because they are gay! I also found out some gay killings have been happening in Israel (no suprise, Jews are anti-gay).

So, anti-gay people here on the forum (and I KNOW you are here)... can you explain it?

Well, not being Jewish, I don't know if I can explain it....

Honestly the dumbest thing I have read in a plea against bigotry.

I am a little surprised that you are surprised by this lorik. Anti-Gay hasn't stopped by a long shot it has just gone underground in America and the UK. I work with a bunch of folk who every day make comments about gays. Bigots are very much alive and well.

It's not right but it will never go away after all the KKK and the National Front are still active...they just don't shout as loud as they used to.

Original Post by loriklorik:

(no suprise, Jews are anti-gay).

Seriously, Lorik? As veji said, in a post railing against bigotry, you sure did reveal yourself as a bigot.

And I can say that as a gay-lovin' jew.

edit to add: How naive are you that you were unaware of the hate crimes that are committed against so many minorities, including homosexuals? Did you never hear of Matthew Shepard?  11 years ago, this October.

The more gay men around the happier I am.... because that means less competition.

Original Post by amethystgirl:

Matthew Shepard?  11 years ago, this October.

I was trying to remember his name, he was the guy in Laramie wasn't he?

Original Post by andie-1:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

Matthew Shepard?  11 years ago, this October.

I was trying to remember his name, he was the guy in Laramie wasn't he?

 yes. 

I did my undergrad at UW.  Once I was with some friends at a bar in Laramie and this guy was annoying my girl friend...so I went up, grabbed her and said she was my girlfriend and to leave her alone.  The guy flipped out and was like, "I can't believe you are doing that...here"  For some reason, I hadn't even considered people being offended or hating or anything.  I was kinda tipsy and university towns are usually a lot more accepting of stuff like that.  But, its still Wyoming.  Sad.  I was hoping it would have changed more in 11 years than it has.

Original Post by loriklorik:

I have to admit, I was a little shocked! Such horrible things against people just because they are gay! I also found out some gay killings have been happening in Israel (no suprise, Jews are anti-gay).

Lorik, please do not make these sort of bigoted generalizations about things you obviously know nothing about. There are quite a few different branches of Judaism - Orthodox, Conservative, Reform, Reconstructionist, and more, none of which condone killing gay people, and most of which actually support gay rights:

• Orthodox Judaism has the strongest opposition to homosexuality, but rabbinic tradition does not condone capital punishment for the offense.
• Conservative rabbis are split, but have lifted most prohibitions on homosexual conduct and permit the blessing of same-sex unions and the ordination of openly gay clergy
• The Reform movement allows ordination of openly gay rabbis and cantors, and allows rabbis to choose to perform same-sex unions if they wish.
• Reconstructionist Judaism supports full rights for homosexuals and strongly encourages (but does not require) rabbis to officiate at same-sex unions.

Please blame the terrible individuals who commit these crimes and not the entire religion, especially since most Jews support gay rights, and no rabbi would condone the murder of anyone based on sexual orientation.

Original Post by loriklorik:

I have to admit, I was a little shocked! Such horrible things against people just because they are gay! I also found out some gay killings have been happening in Israel (no suprise, Jews are anti-gay).

Actually, the reason there was such a level of shock about the recent gay hate crimes in Israel, is that it is usually a gay friendly place.  I've been there and the society is very free and open, especially in the cities.  The ultra orthodox usually keep to themselves, although they do have political clout.  Once in a while, like many religious zealots, they commit a crime like this, but the rest of the society condemns their behavior. 

Here's a news article for your edification.  As you can see, this is a rare thing.

By Ron Bousso (AFP) – Aug 1, 2009

TEL AVIV — A masked man opened fire on a crowd outside a gay club in Tel Aviv, killing two people and wounding 11 others and striking fear into the heart of the liberal Israeli city's homosexual community.

The black-clad gunman unloaded a pistol on the young group of gays and lesbians at the entrance to the centre in the heart of Israel's beachside commercial capital late Saturday and then fled, police and witnesses said.

A teenage girl and a man in his 20s were killed on the spot and three people suffered serious wounds, police said, adding that a manhunt has been launched for the assailant.

"All indications point that this was a criminal incident and not a terror attack, which was most likely deliberately directed against the gay and lesbian community," police spokesman Micky Rosenfeld told AFP.

Thousands of people gathered in the city centre overnight to protest at the attack, some waving rainbow banners and lighting candles for the victims.

"Internal Security Minister Yitzhak Aharonovitch also said he believed the attack had homophobic motives and promised the police would do everything possible to arrest the gunman, military radio reported.

"Tel Aviv-Jaffa has always been a bastion for pluralism, tolerance and openness", Tel Aviv mayor Ron Huldai said in a statement.

"But no one will manage change the city's character. We will continue to offer the gay community a warm house in our city and fight for everyone's right to live according to his faith and beliefs."

In 2005, an ultra-Orthodox Jew stabbed three participants of the gay pride parade. He was later sentenced to 12 years in prison.

Israel repealed a ban on consensual same-sex sexual acts in 1988 and certain rights of gay or lesbian couples have since been recognised by the courts.

I agree--it is a bit naive of you to assume that this was not going on. But then again, it's hard for me to forget as I see Phelps-spawn protesting at least once a month (they are out probably daily but luckily they circulate so I don't always have to see it). Can't wait til my son can read and I have to have that conversation...

Decent people don't condone murder, nor do they promote it to their children. Decent people may have opinions to the contrary, but imo, a decent person would make it VERY clear that even if they didn't agree with homosexuality, it is not okay to hate, harm, humiliate, or kill (etc.) someone you don't agree with. Obviously, if you are teaching or implying to your children that this is okay in any way, you're not really a DECENT person, are you?

I know people who "personally believe homosexuality is wrong" and are still friends with people who are homosexual.  They don't judge their way of life. Their views are obviously different. But they don't run around promoting murder/hate and they certainly aren't the ones pulling the triggers.

The more I learn about life, the more I think I am allergic to any kind of extremists....but I think that's another topic entirely.

I am amused by the use of the term 'agree with' homosexuality in many of the above posts. As if it is possible to agree or disagree with a biological condition.

I have to say, I am a Christian who beleives the practice of homosexuality is wrong, just as the practice of adultery is wrong, or for that matter, someone who doesn't agree with my personal beliefs.  That doesn't mean that I cannot have pleasant conversation with these people, or even have them as friends.  I think the people who seek to harm others are a discrete minority, just as they are in any culture.  Suicide bombers are not the majority, neither are gay-bashers. 

I personally find it difficult to understand those who speak harshly against anyone who is different from them.  That includes people who seek to harm gays, as well as people who can't seem to stand Christians.

Yes, sometimes I do feel like whoever it was that said "Can't we all just get along?"