Killer Vinegar!

I'm really worried, right.

Well not really worried, but concerned.

I love vinegar. Malt vinegar especially, and I POUR it onto my haddock fish, like I've just done for my tea now. I don't squirt or put my thumb over the nozzle just for a little bit, but I pour, until it soaks into the fish and then leaves a relatively shallow pool around it. I never thought anything of it other than it makes for absolutely gorgeously soft fish, complete with peppers and beetroot and a whole range of garnishings I put with it, until my Mum said "Jesus Christ, Ageliki, you do realise vinegar eats up your blood"

Vinegar eats your BLOOD?

Is that true?

Am I risking my health by using so much vinegar?

Is there a healthy vinegar I can use in such quantities?

Is vinegar even healthy?

I only eat this sort of vinegar-laden fish around once a week, so I'm not doing it everyday, but I'm just concerned.

Arghhhhh. Anyone who can help? x.

I'm pretty sure that anything that "eats your BLOOD" wouldn't be sold as a food product.  A quick google search didn't turn up any problems with consuming lots of vinegar, it turned up all the info about vinegar's health benefits. (It's usually easier to just do an internet search with these kinds of questions.)  Of course, it's an acid, and some people's stomachs are sensitive to acids (including citrus juice and vinegar).  Other than that, vinegar is perfectly fine.  

Lmao, "eats your blood". I know, it sounds ridiuculous, but it was the hysteric way she said it that made me all worried. But thanks tons anyway, you've put me at bloody rest! Lol. I wikipedia'ed malt vinegar and had a look, and it didn't say anything too bad either, and it even said Lord Byron used to drink white vinegar to keep his pale complexion. I have no idea if it worked or not though, I mean, I wasn't around centuries ago.

And I reckon my stomachs pretty tough anyway. I mean, I drink orange juice that's concentrated every morning, obviously, I use vinegar like water, and I love things like limes etc. So I should be alright.

Thanks for your reply though! :) xx.

WTF?  No, vinegar is fine.

http://www.healthrecipes.com/apple_cider_vine gar.htm

I found this linked when I googled, vinegar and weight loss, have heard there is a connection. 

Have you talked to your doctor or a nutritionist? Maybe, there is something lacking from your diet, that is causing such extreme cravings.

Quoting: "I wikipedia'ed malt vinegar and had a look, and it didn't say anything too bad either, and it even said Lord Byron used to drink white vinegar to keep his pale complexion."

Maybe the vinegar kept his complexion pale because it was eating his blood!

Seriously, that statement alone (about Lord Byron) could be the explanation... wive's tales probably got started, and the rest is history ;)

I wonder if your Mum meant eats up your bones because:

"Vinegar is an acid which attacks calcium and weakens the bones. The bone in the vinegar is much softer and more brittle then the other bone.Osteoporosis is a bone disease that weakens the bones. Calcium is a mineral found in milk which strengthens the bones and this is why your Doctor tells you to drink lots of milk!"

http://www.ict.mic.ul.ie/websites/2002/Nuala_ OSullivan/experiment.htm

So, I would be a bit cautious with it even though in some portions vinegar can be good for your health. I'd ask your Doctor to be sure!

Vicki

maybe you need to see a different doctor?????

Haha, yeah right. Like I can actually even get into a doctor's here! It's hard enough trying to get an actual doctor to see you within a year, rather than having the privilege of which doctor you get :)

Agelikiaddiction -

Depression and calorie restriction can both cause exhaustion (and dizziness, etc.).  I wouldn't worry about cutting back the vinegar, and focus on eating more of the fish.  (Or, y'know, other things.)

... and yes, I know depression can also be an appetite suppressant.  (For me, it makes me eat *all the freakin' time,* but it definitely does the reverse for a lot of people.)  But insufficient eating (like 1000 Cal or less a day) inhibits cell growth, and depression involves (among other things) a failure of cells in the hippocampus to regrow after they've been damaged by stress, so not eating enough food is really not doing yourself any favors.  :c/

My laptop battery is conking out here, but I hope you don't mind my friending you.  I'm dealing with some of the same issues (depression, a fierce and abiding love of malt vinegar, and now, thanks to my antidepressants, lowered appetite!), and we depressive vinegarites have to stick together!  ;c)

At 16, actually, the teenage rules apply to you.  Not only should you be eating at least 1200 calories a day, you should actually be eating 1500 calories a day (that is if you're attempting to maintain a deficit and lose weight).  While I've no doubt that you don't want a lecture, this site is about healthy eating for weight management.  What you describe yourself as doing is not healthy.  So here's the basic information for you:

Please know that Calorie Count cannot and will not support you eating less than 1200 calories a day. We consider this unhealthy and CC is all about HEALTHY weight loss or weight maintenance

From Mary Hartley, Calorie Count's Director of Nutrition: "By eating only 800 calories, you will not get enough energy, protein, fiber, vitamins, minerals and other components of food. In time, you could become malnourished, which can cause severe health risks such as respiratory infections, kidney failure, blindness, heart attack and even death."

Here is a brief reason why never less than 1200 from the Advice section of Calorie Count Plus, under the Q&A tab:

Why must I eat at least 1,200 calories a day when I want to eat less?

In order to get the daily food servings you need for a balanced diet, it takes about 1200 calories a day. With careful planning, you could have a balanced diet on 1000 calories, but the restrictiveness of a very low calorie level can lead to binging and weight cycling, which will take you further from your weight loss goal. What's more, very low calorie diets can cause excessive muscle breakdown and metabolic adaptations, which can drive down your calorie requirements. In the end, you'll need fewer calories to maintain a higher weight

Your body needs at least 1200 calories per day to survive.

Here is a very rough scientific break down provided by a dietician for a 5' 2", 19 year old female weighing approximately 100 pounds, sitting around all day and doing nothing:

-The heart needs 12% of the calories (144 cals)
-The kidney needs 12% of the calories (144 cals)
-The Liver needs 23% of the calories (276 cals)
-The brain needs 23% of the calories (276 cals)
-The skeletal muscle needs 30% of the calories (360 cals)

Original Post by tori190:

I wonder if your Mum meant eats up your bones because:

"Vinegar is an acid which attacks calcium and weakens the bones. The bone in the vinegar is much softer and more brittle then the other bone.Osteoporosis is a bone disease that weakens the bones. Calcium is a mineral found in milk which strengthens the bones and this is why your Doctor tells you to drink lots of milk!"

http://www.ict.mic.ul.ie/websites/2002/Nuala_ OSullivan/experiment.htm

So, I would be a bit cautious with it even though in some portions vinegar can be good for your health. I'd ask your Doctor to be sure!

Vicki

Original Post by drinkingvinegar:

Original Post by tori190:

I wonder if your Mum meant eats up your bones because:

"Vinegar is an acid which attacks calcium and weakens the bones. The bone in the vinegar is much softer and more brittle then the other bone.Osteoporosis is a bone disease that weakens the bones. Calcium is a mineral found in milk which strengthens the bones and this is why your Doctor tells you to drink lots of milk!"

http://www.ict.mic.ul.ie/websites/2002/Nuala_ OSullivan/experiment.htm

So, I would be a bit cautious with it even though in some portions vinegar can be good for your health. I'd ask your Doctor to be sure!

Vicki

 

Actually you are totally wrong, vinegar adds calcium to the bones by abou  5% Now if you want to know which drinks take calcium from the bone try coke! Phosphus acid....pity you are not a biochemist!

Why revive such an old thread? 

If you google up Bragg's Apple Cider vinegar it lists all kinds of health benefits from the product, but most sound like this mother's old wives tale.  It's really bogus.

Original Post by clairelaine:

Why revive such an old thread? 

If you google up Bragg's Apple Cider vinegar it lists all kinds of health benefits from the product, but most sound like this mother's old wives tale.  It's really bogus.

 I believe it is necessary to correct wrong information don't you ? Bragg's apple cider is a good vinegar, the only problem is that some people make claims, they shouldn't make, in fact it is illegal to make such claims of cures and any company that makes these claims are liable to prosecution, if reported the correct authority. FDA in USA and Food Standards in other countries.

Although it also doesn't help, when consumers also make irresponsible claims either.

My point is that from a bio chemistry point of view, all humans require the essential acids, to balance their bodies. What are essential acids, you may well ask! search www.wikipedia.com for metabolism and you will find the list of amino acids.

Humans thing, that drinking vinegar is adding acid to their already gastric problems, what they do not understand, is that every juice, and every beverage contains only acids, and preservatives.

Now if you compare that to a natural vingar beverage which is organically fermented, you will see no added preservatives, or artifical colouring, you have natures gift of active healthy enzymes.

Though apple cider vinegar does not have the 8 essential acids, because you can only get essential amino acids from protein, which Taiwanese vinegars made.

Brown rice and fruits are fermented for 6 months and are developed by agricultral chemists, the new biotechnology advancement is so advanced, that the mother vinegar microrganisms do not have a vinegar taste at all.

These vinegars are only developed for functional needs, for health reasons.

Facts: http://apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/APJCN/Volume1 7/vol17suppl.1/380-382W5-1.pdf

Remeber there are 3 types of vinegar.

Special brewed, synthetic, and a mixture of the  two.

Apple cider does have benefits, however without amino acids, the health benefits are reduced. To understand amino acids, search wikipedia.com 

You will see that all 8 essential acids have a function, with each one documented.

Original Post by drinkingvinegar:

Actually you are totally wrong, vinegar adds calcium to the bones by abou  5% Now if you want to know which drinks take calcium from the bone try coke! Phosphus acid....pity you are not a biochemist!

Since we're correcting misinformation, I'll correct this statement.  There is no calcium in vinegar.  It does not add calcium to the bones.  It doesn't leach it out the way phosphoric acid does, but it doesn't add it.  Apparently, you are also not a biochemist.

(Regarding the earlier statements about vinegar, calcium and bones: Vinegar would only dissolve the bones if you dropped a piece of bone into vinegar.  As long as you're not cutting yourself open and pouring vinegar on your bones (ouch!), it's fine to drink.  I have heard that drinking too much vinegar thins the blood a little, but haven't investigated further to see if that's true or an old wives' tale.)

You still don't get it, so why not go to the biochemist website at www.pccv.com.tw

And there is 5% calcium in the vinegars, I am not a biochemist but i do work with them in the Chinese traditional health vinegar business, and that is were the knowledge comes from!

The vinegar is fermented for 6 month or 12 months and the organic compounds and minerals, include calcium. Their is less than 2% acetic acid in drinking vinegars when diluted at 5 to 1.

If you or any other are suffering from bone loss, it's due to your pre menstrual life and other drinking habits....

Vinegar is a carrier of calcium, so you are right to say it will eventually disolve a bone if soaked in it, and that is why vinegar is also put into chicken soup too, because when left to soak it will absorb the calcium, which is then carried into the human body.  But there is no scientific evidence at all, that shows vinegar weakens the human bone.

There is however clear scientific evidence that vinegar helps to cut blood sugar, and therefore may reduce the chances of diabetes, and their is scientific evidence to show that drinking vinegar breaks down cholesterol and uric acid salts.

So I suggest you keep researching and let me know, when you find some scientific proof of vinegar reducing the calcium in human bones.

You know a mountains are build, from little mole hills, people spreading all their assumptions and no facts, gossip! Now do your own research and lighten up! It's people like you that makes Braggs apple cider vinegar get its reputation, never tells the facts. I can bust the myths of apple cider vinegar in one demonstration and the myths of weightloss and vinegar.

While you people are just talking gossip and spreading rumours.

First i would suggest understanding Chinese Traditional Medicine, then I suggest you understand the techniques of brewing health vinegar, if i was to drop a whole chicken into the fermentation process, that chicken bone calcium is then in the vinegar, and trasnported to the human body.

Basically brewing vinegar is about choosing the materials correctly, to brew a health vinegar, the correct minerals, and  proteins,  are chosen.

And one more thing....were do you get statins from besides the doctor! Vinegar, again look it up on red yeast rice.

I can only say, you are an amateur in a professionals field! Asking doctors will also not help stupid, do you think general practioners are bio chemists!

I don't need to ask a doctor, thank you.  The reason that I can tell you are not a biochemist is because I was one and am now a chemist.  I'm not just talking gossip or spreading rumours.  If I'm contradicting what you're saying, it's because it's not scientifically valid.  Sorry, but you're the amateur in this discussion.

I'm also not suffering bone loss because I *do* get enough calcium in my diet and I do strength training.  What a strange assumption for you to make about me.  And I never once said that vinegar would reduce the calcium in bones.  Reread my post.  I said the only way that would happen would be to physically pour the vinegar directly on the bone.

You are making a lot of claims about the health benefits of vinegar; however, I have yet to see a proper double blind study showing vinegar outperforming a placebo.  I'll admit it would be very difficult to make a placebo that would convince people they were drinking vinegar; you'd likely have to settle for comparing "properly brewed" vinegar to a comparable strength solution of plain acetic acid.  But that study has yet to be published.  I wonder why...

Edited to note that you should probably refrain from addressing people as stupid.  That's against the forum rules.

You maybe a chemist but you are certainly not an ex bio-chemist, in fact I would call your bluff and ask you to cut and paste your credentials. Now you are in a public forum, with viewers that probably do not live close to you, Post your credentials  and I will post mine?

A bio chemist that ends up a chemist is a failure, just like any GP, that has grand illusions of being a specialist, it looks like you are going backwards, I wonder why? Not that i want to get personal, But I'm challenging you to put facts to back up your your statements! You was a biochemist, and now you are a chemist, utter **** unless you couldn't do the job! And you seem to ignore the fact that fereidoon shahidi who is one of the top professors in the world on food & beverages and phyto nutrients did the analysis on the Taiwan vinegars and they have the status of labeling as functional beverages for cardio vascular diseases, which you can only claim, if you present the documental evidence  to the FDA and other  Food standards Agencies. Now the challenge stands, post your qualifications or put your head in the sand!

You also think you are Pat Bragg from apple cider? Who is nothing more than a nutritionist, but has never claimed to be a biochemist like you are trying and make sure you know what you are talking about, when it comes to vinegar, because it appears that you do not know anything the same as Pat Bragg from braggs apple cider...when challenged she also admitted to being a nutritionist. You see my dear it is illegal to make false claims, under the marketing and advertisement laws of most countries and if you are accusing us of making false claims, you yourself become liable of defamation if you cannot prove what you say. We have proved what we say, including the 5% calcium in drinking vinegar p://www.usp.org/pdf/EN/meetings/ASM2008/bios/shah idiF.pdf 

 You appear to misunderstand, I do not make claims at all, I present facts that is what i am paid to do, and those facts come from world wide experts in the business of researching health benefits from a 3rd party perspective, we are not multilevel marketing, who do their own research and development to scam consumers, so our products have to be FDA approved to pass healthy living standards for functional beverages. To have anyone turn around and make accusations, is very damaging to our business and we will take the matter up in court.

However I do agree about the apple cider vinegar being over rated, but it is still a very healthy drink, if you can stomach it, at 5% acedity, which will do more harm than good, but externally it is a super product.

Mixed with water and honey it will also contribute to health, but without the essential amino acids, it will always be inferior.

Original Post by drinkingvinegar:

You maybe a chemist but you are certainly not an ex bio-chemist, in fact I would call your bluff and ask you to cut and paste your credentials. Now you are in a public forum, with viewers that probably do not live close to you, Post your credentials  and I will post mine?

A bio chemist that ends up a chemist is a failure, just like any GP, that has grand illusions of being a specialist, it looks like you are going backwards, I wonder why? 

My qualification is PhD in organic chemistry.  I prefer not to post information that can lead to personal identification on the internet for what I consider to be fairly obvious reasons.  Of course, I'm not the one who's being paid to post thinly veiled advertisements for my product on the internet.  The reason I switched from biochem to chem had nothing whatsoever to do with taking a step back.  If anything, organic chem is generally considered a tougher field and I was top in my class in both fields; however, I find organic chemistry more interesting/challenging so that was the direction I pursued.  I still work with biochemists as well as chemists and, suffice it to say, I can tell when somebody knows what they're talking about vs. when they're parroting a bunch of marketing material. 

Again, I ask you to show published material demonstrating the 5% calcium content of drinking vinegar.  That link demonstrated nothing of the sort.  It led me to a biochemist at Memorial who has (after a little searching) done some work to show that vinegar contains phenols and other phytonutrients.  Hardly a shocker.  But then, you're the one who apparently doesn't understand the difference between calcium and organics.  Interestingly, a quick search of the keywords "calcium" and "vinegar" on a few key scientific databases shows no publications relating to calcium content of vinegar.  So, you can see why I would question your posts.  (Well, that combined with the dead giveaway of you starting by bringing up a years dead post to disagree with.)