Lots of running questions

I went to my mom's this week to "get away". I'm going back to my house - my husband and regular routine - today. I realized that the idea of my "relaxing" was ridiculous- I have two kids under the age of 4!

I had planned on taking time off of running but my mom's elliptical was making a funny noise so I went out fo rearly morning runs. I'm a treadmill runner so outside running is a rare treat. I found a route which included running to a track, running the track (dirt), and running back. About 1.5 miles of the ~4.25-4.5mile stretch was hills. The problem is that I was slower than when I'm on the treadmill. When I'm on the treadmill I just start a 6.7mph and stick with it, occasionally doing intervals of increased speed. But it all took me 45 minutes. I know I started much more slowly than I normally do... could it be that my body's warmup is different than the treadmill's just... propelling me forward?

Also - runners, how important is hill training, and what kind of difference does running a hill make when you go to a race? Do you burn more calories running a hill?

On top of everything... I wanted to know if it was even remotely possible that I was "overtraining". I upped my runs to about 46 miles last week and walked 15-20 minutes on top of my runs. By Sunday (my off day), I was exhausted. I was cranky and crabby. I wasn't sleeping well and was really tense. I have increased my calories over the past few weeks because I thought that would stave off overtraining, even though I wasn't really additionally hungry. But my body was just.... beat. I have two months until the half marathon and I don't want to burn out - any ideas for a good schedule for the 8 weeks before the halfer? Any input as to how many calories a 26 year old female mother of two might need to avoid "overtraining"?

It's harder to run outside when you're used to the treadmill because outside your glutes/hamstrings have to actually work to propel you forward (whereas on the treadmill the machine does their work for them).

I can't nearly answer all your questions, as I am only a beginner to running and currently training for a 5K.  However, I always run outside, and a little more than half of my running route includes hill.  I have noticed my endurance and strength improve TREMENDOUSLY. 

When I asked for advice about my training in the past, I was encouraged to include hill running as it helps with endurance/distance and strengthens the muscles around your knees (making knee pain less likely) and quads.  Another thing that was suggested to me was to vary my training - do hills some days, sprints others....

Maybe this article from Runner's World will help.  You may have already seen it, as you are an experienced runner, but Runner's World also has specific section on half-marathon training that might be useful to you.

Anyway, I'm probably not terribly helpful since most likely this is basic info for you ... but thought I'd respond anyway :)

I wish you the best of luck in your training!   

Hey thanks guys. I really love the outdoor running its just an entirely different feel. Though I don't feel as stressed out as I did before... I don't know if overtraining has different heads,  but I think that maybe mixing things up can be a good thing.

How often do you guys run?

Treadmills are notoriously inaccurate, not only for calories but distance as well.  You should try to run outside more often to keep the "feel" of it.

Hill training is another way that we build strength in our legs.  If your HM has hills, then I suggest you do some hill sessions during this final 8 weeks.  It's good to know how to push yourself up the hill, without killing yourself, then recover going down the other side.  Anytime you get your heart rate up (consume more oxygen), you are going to burn more calories.

Bethany, you REALLY need to follow the three weeks on one week off so that you have a recovery week.  On recovery week cut your mileage back to 20-25 miles that week.  This gives you time to mentally AND physically recover and just plain do other things.

We eat to fuel our workouts and speed our recovery.  No amount of calories will prevent you from being over trained.  If I was you, I would go look at the last 8 weeks of any half marathon plan out there and use that as the foundation for your own final 8 weeks.  Your mileage will probably be way higher than what's on the plan, but if you use it as a guide line, you should be able to figure out something thats reasonable for you, including the final two week taper before your race.

Wes, thank you.

This week is just what I need then, maybe I'll even take an additional day "off"! And I'll take two days a week during my normal schedule, get up super early, and run outside before my husband gets up for work! 5am, here I come:-D (I love the morning)

How often do you guys run?

I run 3 or 4 times a week, with a day of rest in between.  As I said, I am a beginner, following Couch to 5K right now - so this is probably not relevant enough for your training.  The times I have run 4 times a week have been those where I felt unprepared to move on to the higher intensity level the following week... 

Also, running is such a high-impact sport, that I don't think (even if I got better at it) that my body could withstand running every day.  In my opinion, I find that as I get better at running, cross-training becomes even more important and does more to improve my running than running itself.  Does that make any sense?  Maybe I'm completely mistaken - I'm not as experienced as others.  But that's my impression so far from the last 6 weeks.

I am also a beginnger runner and I run between 4-6 miles right now training to finish a 20k.  I run 3-4 days a week always with a day of rest between runs.  I feel like this makes a HUGE difference and I can run longer and feel better if I rest.  I only run outside and I think running inside vs. outside and the terrain you run all make a huge difference. 

I run in the woods and there are a lot of things that make it more difficult: soft ground/sand, tall thick grass, uneven ground/roots/pinecone, hills, heat and humidity.  When I get a chance to run on a level paved surface it is a BREEZE and I feel like I could run forever. 

My point is, don't feel bad for slowing down when you go outside, it IS harder.  I think it would benefit any runner to run outside sometimes especially if you are going to run a race.  Plus when you are outside you have to learn to control your pace instead of the treadmill doing it for you. 

Original Post by floggingsully:

It's harder to run outside when you're used to the treadmill because outside your glutes/hamstrings have to actually work to propel you forward (whereas on the treadmill the machine does their work for them).

I've read somewhere that setting an incline on the treadmill helps with this problem. Running outside is great but when it's 95F outside I have to stick with air conditioning.

Hi! Calorie intake and overtraining are 2 different issues- calories will not help prevent you from overtraining-it will help you to make sure you are not losing too much weight and energy for your runs.

1. Calories- use the calorie calculator on this site and input your weight/height/ activity and it will tell you how many calories you are burning- this will give you a good idea of how many to eat. It also depends on your pace when you run. Check out this link for more information: http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-242-304-311-8402-0,00 .html and:http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-242-304-311-12723-0,0 0.html

2. Overtraining: your overall mileage for a half or full marathon is fine, but it sounds like you have upped your mileage too fast. If you are increasing your weekly mileage > 10% each week, you are not increasing your mileage safely and are seriously risking injury (not to mention derailing all of your hard work for the half). Read more at http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-238-267--1051-0,00.ht ml

Original Post by dvbourassa:

I've read somewhere that setting an incline on the treadmill helps with this problem. Running outside is great but when it's 95F outside I have to stick with air conditioning.

The glutes and hamstrings work to pull the leg backwards, the leg is being pushed backwards by the treadmill no matter how steep the incline is. 

setting the incline offsets the help that the treadmill is giving you and lack of wind resistance because you are having to run up hill.  Not matter what the incline is, you still have to use your glutes and hamstrings to lift your leg up and put it down again.

Original Post by wesmckean:

Not matter what the incline is, you still have to use your glutes and hamstrings to lift your leg up and put it down again.

The quads and hip-flexors are what lift the leg up (at least up in front of you) and gravity does most of the work when your putting your leg down.  I guess the glutes/hamstrings would do some work if you have a big 'kick' behind you when running, but most of the work they would do when your running get's done by the treadmill. 

If you do triathlons, you are keenly aware of which muscles you use for each discipline.

I've done triathlons, and I'm not aware of any discipline that involves running on a treadmill.

Running up actual hills works the glutes/hamstrings more than running on flat ground.  But running on a treadmill, reguardless of the incline, requires very little effort from the glutes/hams.

Good!  We'll just agree to disagree then, fs....

Hills training can help your running.  Hill training is similar to interval training and that's why a lot of marathon training plans will inlcude TUT (Total Uphill Time) in the runs.  On top of being good intervals, they're also necessary so that you know how to run hills because it doesn't come naturally to everyone.  Keep in mind that how you run down hills them is just as important and how you run up them.  There's a video on runners world that was posted earlier that's decent.

http://www.runnersworld.com/video/1,8052,s6-5-0-1,00.html?bcpid=2 884339001&bclid=27960358001&bctid=274 57075001

As for treadmills vs. running outside.  There are a lot of things different between the two.  Treadmills usually offer better cushion than road running.  It's even gotten to the point that some treadmills have a bounce affect that can make running a lot easier than it really is.  There's also terrain, wind, traffic, and psychological differences.  I think most people find running outside a little bit more difficult than running on a treadmill but less boring.

Hey guys.

I often incorporate hills into my running on the treadmill as well as random upping the speed. If I'm cruising at 6.7, I'll put up the incline and set it to 7.0 or 7.1 for a couple of minutes and then go back to 6.8 or something before lowering the incline. I'll do that a few times to mix things up, and I usually start off on an incline. It helps me warm up.

I was back on the treadmill today since I'm back at home and did a speedy 5 miler. The trick is convincing myself that I'm not supposed to be doing 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 miles every day and hopefully I'll feel more like doing a long run again next week.

My questions about calories and overtraining were due to the fact that when I initially upped my miles (before my injury, back in February) I wasn't eating enough, probably averaging 1,400 or 1,500 calories a day but having days where, say, after my long run when I wasn't hungry, I just wouldn't eat much. I have increased my calories hoping to stave off the moodiness that came with that TERRIBLE fatigue and the eventual injury. I'm not sure how much I ate last week but I was trying to keep it up at 1,800-2,000 even though I wasn't that hungry. This week it has been more like 2,200 per day.

Original Post by floggingsully:

Running up actual hills works the glutes/hamstrings more than running on flat ground.  But running on a treadmill, reguardless of the incline, requires very little effort from the glutes/hams.

What muscles are worked when you run on a treadmill? I can see that running outside is probably a lot harder (I live in the tropics, so I prefer to run indoors where the humidity isn't 95%!) but I still feel like I am getting a workout with just the treadmill running.

Floggingsully, if you think treadmills require much less work from the legs, can you explain this?  Article

To the OP, it seems you have a lot of questions about running. I highly suggest and recommend Runner's World Forums.

Original Post by bmx419:

Floggingsully, if you think treadmills require much less work from the legs, can you explain this?  Article

 I am assuming this woman does run outside for the 5 months of the year it isn't freezing cold out.  Cool story, very inspiring!