what does it take to make a "bad" dog?

i'm just trying to figure this out.  because i've only had two dogs in my life, and they've both been cast-offs, so you'd assume that they've done something wrong.  both had so-called aggressive breeds (rottweiller in the first, rhodesian ridgeback in my new baby).  and both have been better-mannered than most human beings.

so that brings me to my question: here are two powerful, "aggressive," dominant dogs, both rejected by their human families for some unknown reason, both dumped in spca shelters as adolescents. 

it's pretty clear that neither of these dogs were too-badly abused (although both cowered at the sight of a stick, and the latter used to have a submissive-peeing issue).  but neither were they too-well loved.  and yet, both ended up totally loving, beautifully mannered, absolutely trustworthy.

so: what really has to be done to a big, strong, powerful, dominant dog to make it dangerous?  it boggles the mind. 

what really has to be done to a big, strong, powerful, dominant dog to make it dangerous?

Probably not much.  But it doesn't sound like either of your dogs were/are aggressive by nature. 

neither has/had a lick of aggression toward humans; both had issues with other dogs, when they were younger. 

but you're right.  as much as kenya loves to track rabbits, her favourite thing in the world is to get her teddy and come cuddle with me.

i just don't think my dogs are so much the exception as the rule.

The fact that dogs more closely related to wolves (ie fewer generations of artificial human-driven selection) tend to randomly "snap" and attack kids indicates that bad behavior is partly genetic. right?

If more pitbulls than golden retrievers maul babies & toddlers despite the fact that there are more golden retrievers than pitbulls around as pets, clearly something genetic is going on.

But Id guess that most/all bad dogs have had bad owners.

genetically, i think chihuahuas are as closely related to wolves as are german shepherds. 

theoretically my lion dog should be closer to a real predator than most domestic dogs.  and terriers are probably the most ferocious of the actual breeds; they're just--mostly--smallish.  but the bottom line is that most dogs do what they're asked.

I remember when I was twelve a dog chased me for probably a mile on my bike.  I think that was a bad dog.

But I think most "bad dogs" are the product of bad handling by their owner.  I'm no dog expert though, just something I've noted through observation.  All my dogs I've had since they were very young so I don't know what its like to get one from a former owner with its own set of habits.

And I love German Shepherds.  :D

i love german shepherds, too :)

i think they're beautiful, and loyal, and incredibly obedient.  and, man, do they ever know their jobs - whether it's defined by humans or not.  ever meet a german shepherd on his rounds?  just try to distract him.

Yeah, I love the one I grew up with.  Sadly his time came and went, and I'm not living in a place where I can keep another one at home.  Soon, however, I will be moving and I'll acquire a new puppy.  :D

There are many reasons why dogs end up in shelters rarely because they are bad things like owner circumstances, didn't realise the dog would grow so big, neglect/abuse and so on. 

Here I don't know any charity including the SPCA which will take a bad dog on generally they are destroyed and we never see them.

I have only had one bad dog, and he was put down after veterinarian and SPCA assessment,  plus a final action on his part.....he was a terrier.

Neglect, mistreatment, boredom, jealousy .....  Dogs can also be deliberately trained to be aggressive.   Hence why the packs of foxhounds used in fox-hunting couldn't have been rehoused when the ban took effect.  Also hence why dogs that have been police-trained to attack assailants can't be housed with regular families, only dog-handlers. 

Breeding plays a big part...  The terrier above was from a long line of dogs selected for their ability to kill rats or rabbits.  Left untrained and unsocialised, this natural tendency can take over and make it dangerous.   I've seen Jack Russells attack a barnful of rats....  it's not pretty.

He was a JR funny enough, he was a last chance case, and a lot of money was spent at vets and specialist, everything was done that could be to try and rectify his behaviour so he was given every chance possible.

But after all that and for no reason one day on the beach a choc lab came over to say hello ( i didn't see it coming up behind us) well he got a hold of it in his teeth and wouldn't let go, i ended up dragging them into the sea and sticking his head under water before he released. By that time he had torn a large strip of flesh off of the labs back (well not off it was hanging there)...at that point i decided enough was enough he was dead within an hour of this happening. If i think about it i can still hear that lab I have never heard first hand anything like the noises that poor dog was making.

(the beach was empty when we went there i checked and he was on a leash).

if they draw blood and show unprovoked aggression

Original Post by ktjo:

if they draw blood and show unprovoked aggression

I think the dog that chased me just wanted to eat my face.  Does that count?

It's all nature and nurture.  The right set of genes and growing up in the right circumstances cause a dog to become aggressive.

I have a dog with issues.  She's nervous natured and has been that way from a very young age.  Had she grown up in a different environment she might be extremely fearful and bite people or dogs out of that fear.  She doesn't because I worked hard to prevent that sort of thing from happening but she still doesn't like strangers to be very animated or do anything out of the ordinary.  If they do she lets them know she isn't happy about it and barks at them to stop it. 

Please don't turn this into another Pitbulls are crazy monsters and randomly snap and attack people argument.  It's untrue and disgusting.

What makes a bad dog? Bad people. The fact that it's big, strong, powerful, dominant doesn't mean it's going to be vicious. Most smaller dogs will go for your ankles way before a big dog will (feel threatened cuz they're so small and you look so big??!) It also doesn't mean that it won't be abused. There's no such thing as a bad dog.

I wish I had a rottweiler and a rhodeshian ridgeback!

Original Post by jewelsmcblah:
Please don't turn this into another Pitbulls are crazy monsters and randomly snap and attack people argument.  It's untrue and disgusting.

In Britain a staffordshire bull terrior (not quite a pitbull but close enough) is the safest dog you can get statistically. 

The most dangerous, for attack on children etc? Border collies (sheepdogs). Why? Because they are working dogs, they are not, for the most part, being worked anymore and they are going crazy with all that unburnt energy

I think you will find that it is golden retrievers which are the most guilty breed for biting children in the UK..

http://www.saferpets.co.uk/SafeDogBreedsForCh ildren.html                                    

I don't agree that a bad dog = a bad person, i say it's more lack of knowing how to train the dog... by proportion there are really not that many people who actively train their dogs to attack.

I'm not a bad person, but that JR was a dog with real problems but he came to me with them ( he was 1 1/2yrs old). It's wrong to assume that the person with the dog has had it since it was a pup and is responsible for it's behaviour.

Frok: yes that does count :D

Original Post by frokusblakah:

And I love German Shepherds.  :D

if you do you will see a rather cute one in my gallery, my mate collects him next week (her new puppy).

Original Post by andie-1:

I think you will find that it is golden retrievers which are the most guilty breed for biting children in the UK..

http://www.saferpets.co.uk/SafeDogBreedsForCh ildren.html                                    

I don't agree that a bad dog = a bad person, i say it's more lack of knowing how to train the dog... by proportion there are really not that many people who actively train their dogs to attack.

I'm not a bad person, but that JR was a dog with real problems but he came to me with them ( he was 1 1/2yrs old). It's wrong to assume that the person with the dog has had it since it was a pup and is responsible for it's behaviour.

Frok: yes that does count :D

 

Whoops my bad, my dad told me about collies and I didn't bother checking it out!

I didn't mean that you're a bad person, you didn't have him since a puppy so you probably did a lot more to help him than to give him his problems. Maybe it's not ALWAYS right that a "bad" dog is bad because of his owner/previous owner/whatever but I do think 99% of the time it is. It's like when you see a kid that's really naughty, disruptive, rude etc, and another that is polite, respectful etc. MOST of the time it will be how that child was/is being brought up.

Collies are just so much damn fun though!  If you're a really energetic person they are a great dog.  My parents have one at home, and my younger siblings still haven't left yet.  Between all the kids he is played with enough that never really gets into that pent up "so much energy but no where to use it!" state.  :b

Original Post by frokusblakah:

Collies are just so much damn fun though!  If you're a really energetic person they are a great dog.  My parents have one at home, and my younger siblings still haven't left yet.  Between all the kids he is played with enough that never really gets into that pent up "so much energy but no where to use it!" state.  :b

It's just when they have literally nothing to do that they can sometimes turn on people. I agree they are lovely dogs, but they were originally working dogs and as few people are shepards anymore they don't got worked (and lot's of people simply can't be bothered to play with them and walk them enough) so they get frustrated and go crazy!