My Mother, and Cultural Attitudes Toward Weight Loss

So I was on the phone catching up with my mom yesterday...I told her what was going on in my life...studying for school, hanging out with the man, deciding to start my Ph.D., losing weight and living a healthy lifestyle.

Told her I've lost a few pounds, have been eating very well, and exercising. Immediately, she says, "last time I saw you I thought you were skinny enough!"

Last time she saw me, I was probably 136 pounds. I'm five feet three inches tall. I am very well aware that I am in a healthy weight range, but also aware that I am on the high side of that range, and I'd like to be somewhere closer to the middle, for many reasons.

The paramount reason is that this is what would make me comfortable and happy!

I tell her I want to have a flat stomach, for once in my life. She says: "With your body type you'll never have a flat stomach." Way to encourage, mom. I want a flat stomach not only because I'd like to wear something that shows my midriff, but also because I am very concerned about what they say about excess abdominal fat and the problems it can cause later on in life...I'm a definite "apple" or "cone" and if I trim down, I would feel much more healthy.

My mother is Black -- African-American. I am a multicultural person. So I tend to resist the expectations placed on me by members of any group, really. But it seems to me that Black people are always telling me "don't get too skinny now!"

I told this to my mom and she said that Black people perceive thinness as a White person thing. I told her how ignorant this was, as ignorant as the notion that READING is a White people thing. She said she knows -- yet she still continues to say ridiculous things to me like "Don't become anorexic!"

Jeez! I'm currently 131 pounds and 5'3". I don't think I'm anywhere NEAR anorexic and I also don't think my goal of 120-125 pounds is in any way, shape or form unhealthy!

I know I have to live my life and continue along the path I know is best for me. But how can I interact with my mother about these issues without her driving me absolutely INSANE? Then I start yelling at her, we fight, she makes me feel guilty, and the awful mother-daughter vicious cycle ensues.

ALSO -- I am curious about other races and cultures, and perceptions toward weight. I think the attitude of many Black people toward being "too skinny" is a matter of eschewing the norms that the dominant culture in this country, and Western society put forth.

Does anybody else have experience with cultural-specific attitudes towards diet/weight loss, esp. in relation to dominant/mainstream culture? I wanna know.

First, speaking as a mother, It does not help anything to yell at your mother.  She is trying to do her best by you, with what tools she has.
Some cultures define skinny as sickly.  Larger is healthier?
Some cultures have horror stories to tell about starvation and famine.

Normally, this is the type of intellectual discourse that I thrive on. 

Unfortunately, regarding weight/body image, as they relate to different cultures, we're in a realm that I don't really have any experience.

As far as Mom goes, if her comments bother you (and they would bother me too) don't bring the issue up with her.   Some people are never going to have their mind changed, even when you make total sense.   Willful ignorance isn't something that can be overcome.  You try, you try again, and eventually you just have to throw up your hands and move on.

If you know you are healthy, and it makes you happy, do what you know is right for you. 

My mother is almost the complete opposite of yours.

Ever since I started gaining weight in my early teens, she tried to get me to diet.  It was probably the most damaging thing to my self esteem.  She took me out to dinner to tell me that my butt was getting too big.  She also believes that because her butt is completely flat (genetics) and therefore does not jiggle, that all thin people should not have butts that jiggle.  I am a pear, not an apple shape like her.

Maybe if I carried all of my extra weight in my breasts like her, she wouldn't have said anything and I'd have a normal relationship with food and a good body image.

At the time she told me my butt was too big, I was 5'7" 147 lbs, weighing 1lb less than I do now. 

I know she thought she was doing it out of love and concern, but I basicly felt like all she cared about was my appearance, like she was embarrassed by me.  Not a good time in my life.

My family is caucasian if that helps.

Honestly, I'm really envious that many black women are proud of what they are. They can be big yet be proud of it and wear skirts or other revealing apparels without a problem. At least that's how I percieve it. As for me, I'm in a healthy weight range yet I'd NEVER wear short skirts or other revealing stuffs because I'm so self conscious. Yet I just hope I could wear that someday when I'm more proud of my body.

Having said that, where I come from, Asia, people are .... a bit too skinny. More like anorexic look is the trend. Everybody is on a diet of some sort, they need to get in the "healthy" weight range of between 40kg to 50kg for 5' ~ 5'6'' . Let me translate that for you. That's about 88lbs to 110lbs. Is that healthy? No. It's probably eating out their souls and bodies. I'm 5'4'', about 115lbs. If I went there, I might even be called a little chubby!!! Honestly, I might go back to visit my country one day and I'll be afraid of what people are going to say... And that upsets me because I'm healthy but they have their own value of aesthetics that are rather destructive.

Okay, I'll end my rant now but thanks for bringing this up. I've been needing to vent about that for a while..

-Lemon Jello

i'm hispanic and i do agree with and understand that different cultures have different views on weight.  With hispanics alot of the family time is spent centered around food, cooking, eating etc...so it's not uncommon for many to be overweight, plus spanish food is not the healthiest.   But many hispanics to embrace the extra weight, women just say they've got their curves, ha...and I have noticed that family telling me not to get too skinny.  Plus there's always the "have some more" comments, not just now because I'm dieting, but always in my family there's a have seconds and thirds trend.

ok spoiled_candy, i'll give you that, i should not yell at my mother. i don't yell right away, only after she keeps telling me that what i'm doing is wrong, even though I know that it is not and i try to explain to her. i try to be better. she doesn't deserve it.

it does help...explains why a lot of people think that White people have an unhealthy obsession with being thin.

even though they are opposite problems, i think they are both wrong and cause a lot of unnecessary stress. all of our views on health are so distorted. 

i also think this topic speaks across cultures to the intersection of family and weight issues. such pressure! funnily, my parents (my dad is from Puerto Rico) never once said i was getting too fat (i reached the 190s in high school). and i remember drinking pepsi like it was water, and getting two roast beef sandwiches from arby's for one meal. with extra horseradish. and it was always okay. i can't believe i used to eat that way.

My dad was Scandinavian, and luckily his attitude was that I would do what I needed when I was ready and I was fine the way I  was.

My mom is German {technically German from Russian desendant , long bit of history, involving Germans who were colonists in Russia, till the Czar got nasty and many if not most left for the US.}.

My mom has had weight issues most of her life. About 16/17 years ago my mom got on Slim Fast kick and dropped a fair amount of weight {she was never obese just overweight}, and managed to mostly keep it off.

I've been heavy since puberty and my mom was usually always on my case about my weight. It used to bug me, and would make me want to eat more.  Now that I am also a mom {to a teenager from heck, boy}, I know it was out of love, but still misplaced.

Now that I"ve lost quite abit of weight and my mom has gained a little bit back {she's 75, so I'm sure her eating habits have changed}, when I talk about my weight and how I eat she keeps telling me I need to be careful I don't loose too much weight and to not be too carried away. I'm 5'4" and 163 pounds. I eat 1500-1800 calories a day on average. I'm hardly too thin or anorexic. But it still bugs me. I think its just a mother/daughter thing as much a a a culture. I'm built very much like my mother. When I am insulting my body shape, indirectly I am sure it could be taken as comment on her.  And when I talke bout my eating habits and changes, to some extent it could be viewed as a commentary on her, her parenting, and the way she cooked for me, taught me to cook when I was younger.

Its really a very complicated issue, and culture is only one part of it.

Im white and my stepfather's black. Whenever i see his side of the family and his relatives that are in rural missippi, they tell me im too skinny and i need to put some meat on my bones and im 190!. But ive never really noticed a white versus black thing between my friends and family.

that is interesting tree, so it's also a regional thing, i'm speculating. it's a very complicated issue and it probably varies a lot among individual family units.

good conversation folks. great insights and stories. 

i think it is Definately regional as well. For example, this summer I went backpacking in england and visited some cousins and my aunt. I had recently lost about 30 pounds (I was 5'5 and 120) and they all commented about how great/healthy I looked. When i returned home it was an entirely different response (i.e. was the food that bad in england? you look ill- etc). this was at the same weight that I had been on vacation! i guess in a society that is used to public transportation and walking around, a thin girl is less shocking than in the 'fast-food' society that has come to represent america.

I think cranky raised a really excellent point- when you talk about weight loss to someone who is heavier than you (and you yourself are not even overweight), it can definitely be percieved as an attack on that other person....I know when I was heavier and my thin friends would bitch about their barely existant flab I'd be thinking "jeez, she must thinking i'm a repulsive blimp".

Also, I agree that it's cultural...I'm white and live in a predominantly black neighborhood-->if I go jogging in tightish pants I get catcalls and horn honks but for white men I may as well be invisible.

While I admire the black community's acceptance of 'big is beautiful' on one hand, it is also destroying their health as they have much higher rates of diabetes and hypertension (and probably will think their white male doctors are full of crap when they advise weight loss).

From my experience, Asian American girls tend to receive a lot of pressure from their parents (and Asian adults in general) to be thinner. Many of my Asian American friends have told me that at least one of their parents has commented on their weight, despite their all being within the healthy range. The reactions from my friends range from accepting it to dieting to self mutilation. Personally, being an Asian American, when I was 14 and maybe 19 BMI, I was getting called fat by my father. I sort of believed it too, being unaccustomed to the meat that comes with puberty. Then these feelings would just wind up reinforced whenever I visited China, where girls are skin and bones and where sizes run smaller.  Luckily, I was too much of a gourmand to develop any EDs. Recently, 3 years later, my father made a remark approving of my weight (19-19.7 BMI). I think his tactic was just to scar me enough so I would stay on the thin side (and to get me to stop going through bags of cookies in a week, which is good seeing how my childhood metabolism has died.)

Hey, Lemonjello, i can totally relate to you.

The "standards" in Asia is like 10 times higher than those in North America. I'm 5'11 and 145 lbs. In Canada, everybody says I'm skinny. But i went back to Hong Kong last year with the same height and weight, at least 5 people (including guys) have suggested me to lose some weight. I was having a hardtime to adjust my self-esteem since I was told by Canadians that I was too skinny but I was also told by Hongers that I was fat.

I think if i lived in Asia, I would have to be 125 lbs to fit into the "pretty" category for my height.

Actually I'm still having a hardtime adjusting to the 2 standards...One way i want to be skinner but another way i like the way i am....Different cultural standards is really pain in the butt..

Hey missreporter,

I think this is a very interesting topic, and I am glad you brought it up. I'm Caucasian and my parents never commented on my weight either way. My mom always emphasized health and encouraged my sister and I to eat well and exercise, but never in a nagging way. Even when I started to pack some pounds on toward the end of high school, she never said anything. I guess she was too afraid to damage my self-esteem! Haha. Good intentions, but it might have been nice to have a wake-up call from her.

Since I've started losing, both of my parents have been really complimentary. So I guess they definitely noticed that I needed to lose, and they were just afraid to say anything until I actually lost some.

 

Well Missreporter, I think what has happened here is simply that you and your mom have had a common miscommunication. It is clear that you are already at a healthy weight, and your mother is right to express concern if you are there and talking about losing weight. She may not have expressed it as gently as she should have, but you are a lucky girl to have a mother who looks out for your health.

That said, you clearly are looking out for your health. The two of you are in definite agreement on that, so you can work from that foundation. Unfortunately in your OP, I hear you describing your plan first in terms of your comfort, your happiness, and your flat stomach. If your mother is anything like mine, she's probably hearing that and picturing anorexic magazine models who are perfectly comfortable at 85 pounds.

Do you think she would have responded differently if you'd described your effort as "toning up" your figure, instead of just losing weight? Of course you're talking about losing fat, but what about gaining muscle tone and fitness? Your mother might respond more positively if she was aware that you were working toward a health goal, not a scale number. Her comfort with your work might increase if you were to explain to her how that healthy weight range is a broad spectrum for everyone. If you were to provide her with information about your bone structure (wrist measurements are great) and how that affects where you should be in that range, she might come closer to understanding that you are working WITH your natural body type to reach an optimal level of health.

Miss Reporter, you sound like a very intelligent girl. I had a similar experience involving a conversation between my sister and her kids' father who is Mexican American. We were all sitting there at their place and my sister was telling him that she wanted them to get couple's counseling (their relationship was fairly unhealthy) and he flat out said, and I quote "counseling is for white people". 

So yes, I'm pretty sure that cultural attitudes are real and many of them are not helpful.  This may be part of your mother's response, but also I guess you might look at why she got to you so bad. Why it upset you. I know my mom as well as my dad can upset me a lot because, embarrasingly enough I guess I still want their approval. 

Anyway, I would say don't let her bully you into being less healthy just so you can be "black enough". For example, soul food is a part of the black identity but it is usually outrageously unhealthy (however delicious). You seem completely reasonable in your weight goals. And I am not saying this as a white person who comes from a family who thinks a BMI of 19 is overweight. I'm the only one in my immediate family who isn't obese. 

miss reporter: i didnt read any of the replies but i skimmed through them, and i didnt see anyone really agree with you! my mom isnt black, so culture aside, my mom is the same way! ugh shes driving me CRAZY!!! she used to always tell me the same thing -- that i will never have a flat stomach. and i believed her, because i am an "apple" like you. and because i looked at all the women in my family on her side, and they are all apples. but then i realized something -- none of them ever dieted(or watched what/how they ate) or worked out. and guess what? i now have a flat tummy. you CAN do it.

also my mom is constantly harrassing me to add more sugar, butter, fat to my diet. it's THE. MOST. annoying thing ever. i have grown to love plain food, without anything added. i love appreciating the natural flavors of things. and all she can yap about is "it tastes better with butter! add some sugar! you need something with fat to fill you up"

i know, you want to yell. sometimes i do. but otherwise just ignore her. calmy tell her "no mom, i like it this way, but thats for the idea"

Try being asian.  My mom is 5' 2" 95 lbs and thinks I'm fat no matter what.  I was anorexic for 8 years with her help!  She would encourage me to stop eating.  Want to trade?

Hmm it could be that your mom is uncomfortable with her weight and therefore doesn't want you to lose, or it could really be a cultural thing. Like asian people are normally really thin (I'm asian, I'm 4'10" and about 85 lbs and my relatives are always pinching my cheeks and telling me how fat I am), and I've noticed that there are some big black people but then again there are a lot of big white people too. Your mom sounds kind of insecure, so if losing weight is what will make you happy, then you should go for it. Your family will eventually come to terms with your weight loss.