If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

You're right, the insurance companies dont want our money.

wow, I seem to have inadvertently misspoke!

Original Post by: hetznutz2

If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

The insurance industry is experimenting with that.  Read this past Calorie Count Blog, Getting Paid to Lose Weight.

My thoughts exactly hetznutz2. If health insurance companies would assist with weight loss efforts they would save money on long term effects of obesity. I can't afford a nutritionist or a personal trainer. I can barely afford a gym. I have none of the diseases related to obesity yet, but if I didn't do what I am doing now, there's no doubt in my mind that I would use up a lot of my health insurers money. If my insurance paid for a nutritionist or subsidize a trainer, I would be even more likely to be successful.

Side Note: What about subsidizing the cost of healthy alternatives to horrendous food? Don't make junk food more expensive, make healthy food cheaper!

Original Post by: Mary_RD

Original Post by: hetznutz2

If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

The insurance industry is experimenting with that.  Read this past Calorie Count Blog, Getting Paid to Lose Weight.

My insurance company covers weight management programs at their main clinic, up to and including bariatric surgery.  I lost 100 lbs utilizing their Very Low Calorie Diet and all i had to pay for was the nutritional supplements that replaced my meals each week.  I paid $10 per box of shakes and bars, so my weekly grocery bill was $70 which is much less than the groceries and dining out i would have spent money on.  Most insurance companies, at least in my area, have an incentive program that will reimburse you a nominal amount of money for health and wellness activities.

What you need to understand is when it comes to insurance offered through an employer, the EMPLOYER picks the benefits on the policy, and with each benefit comes a cost associated to a risk pool (that's how insurance works by the way...it's all about risk).  employers don't choose these options because they would be a higher cost premium to their entire group of employees.  

Most insurance policies cover visits with nutritionists as well as a regular office visit.  You should really contact your insurance company to find out what they do cover, you may be surprised.  

It's true, we may be saving with health care costs (co-pays, etc), but still, each year my monthly healthcare plan deductions from my paycheck keep going up, up, up.  Those of us who work to stay healthy don't see a break on that cost.  I spend way more than I save on gym membership, healthy groceries (what I spend on prodcue alone each week nearly breaks the bank), vitamins, workout gear, etc.  However,  it's still worth it in the long run. 

Now, that said, add the number of obese children in America to the number of adults and WOWZA~!  That's our future!  We need to get our young people back on a healthy path, otherwise their health care costs as adults will paint a very ugly picture.  (Just my opinion, of course...)

Frankly, folks, do we all need a nutritionist and personal trainer to lose weight?  Sure, that may be the best way to go, but it is not necessary.  With all the information out there (much of it here), just about everyone should be able to get on a good path without someone else planning out a custom method.  I was overweight simply because I ate too much, I drank too much, and I did not do enough of everything else.  I did not need a nutritionist to tell me my diet was garbage, nor did I need a personal trainer to tell me to get off my fat butt and get moving.

I certainly have saved money by losing weight.  When I started eating better, drinking less, and exercising regularly, I lost 40 pounds over about two years.  At the same time, my blood pressure, cholesterol, and all those other things people look at went out of the bad ranges and into the good.  Because I was unable to get the best life insurance rates before, I went back and got a new policy.  My savings in the first year paid for an elliptical trainer, and that was just the beginning.  Those savings are locked in for the term of the 30 year policy.  While the insurance company gave me no monetary assistance, they certainly gave me an incentive.

Plus, I get to feel better every day.

I agree making healthy foods cheaper. 

Whole Foods Market=whole paycheck.  Thank goodness for farmers markets.

Health care costs and missed work, while significant, are just the tip of the financial iceberg.

I did not realize how much I was spending extra on clothes, for example, until I lost enough weight to buy at retail stores.  Perhaps as much as $1000 a year for the exact same things, and I dont buy that many clothes.

Not to mention the damage being large did to my career advancement and earning power.

Then I think about the money ive wasted on being comfortable in my surroundings when I just needed to drop weight. 

Losing 100 pounds actually has affected my gas mileage.  Not much, but its still extra money.

Add it all up, and it dwarfs the cost of losing the weight.

I find the US health care system really wierd... but interesting that obesity makes someone personally accountable (out of their own pocket) to take care of obesity.

While having government health care in Canada is fantastic (although realize this is just basic health care - doctor/hospital/lab tests; it doesn't cover much on prescriptions and "other" things - you have to have extended benefits through work for that or pay yourself), it puts the onus on paying for obesity on the general tax-paying public.

I'm not sure how obesity statistics compare between the two countries, but it would be interesting to see what the difference is between somwehere where your own insurance cost makes you accountable for your obesity and somewhere where the government takes care of it for you....

You'd think Canada would be the "more obese" country... but I don't think it is....  ???

It costs more to eat Heathy!! Think about it. You can go anywhere and get something off the dollar menu. If you take the time to go to the store and make something healthy you're spending triple. Which is very sad.:(

This is some information I found out about American vs. Canadian Obesity: http://eaves.ca/2008/07/08/fatness-index-canada-vs-united-st ates/

It does cost more to eat healthy, your right.  You spend your money one way or another- either on medical bills or good food and good health.  You get to decide which one you want to spend it on.  I choose good food and I shop at Whole Foods, and natural food stores.  I rather have the best organic produce keeping me and my family at the best of health.  This not only helps me and my family but keeps the earth cleaner, supports small farming (not big Agriculture), and makes the world a little less toxic.  More chemicals are dumped on farmland each year, and guess where they end up?  Our bodies.  This is a price everyone is paying for cheep food.  Why?  Because they can grow more, faster and more efficiently, in the SHORT TERM, but someday that well is going to dry up.  It's coming and there is more cancer each and every year.  

There were orange groves in CA that have been turned into subdivisions, they wanted to put in neighborhood parks and they tested the soil and they don't meet the standards for parks- the soil is too toxic.  TOO TOXIC?  But it was ok to grow food in it??!!  

Do you think peeling that orange took the pesticide off??  It is in the roots, the soil, the plants, and then the fruit.  That is typical of today's farming practices.  Yes, I will pay more for my food, and I will pay for organic.  I will have a smaller house, and deal with it.  What is the point of all America's consumerism, if you don't even have your health?  Great car, too bad you are deathly ill? 

Why should the insurance company pay for us to do the right thing?  To take care of ourself?  The answer is obvious- you should take care of yourself, so you can be healthy and you won't need to pay big bucks for medical insurance, or life insurance.  Besides that you will feel better and live a longer happier life.

Get a clue America and put your money where your mouth is.  

Thanks leilanijj... interesting information!!

I would rather see insurance companies reward those of us who CHOOSE to make the right decisions and lose the weight and exercise with lower premiums or financila rebates rather than paying for surgery that has high recidivism rates. I have seen so many peoplel here lose over 100 pounds on their own without surgery!! THey should be rewarded for that.

To take the conversation in a different direction...I struggle with the term "obese" and it's use with BMI.  A 5'5", 180 lb. woman would NOT seem obese to me.  Overweight, sure, but not obese.  My visual definition of obese is, well, ginormous- the person who can't fit in the seat on the airplane, or the person who waddles when they walk. 

I'm 5'6" and 209 lbs- down from 252.  I don't feel like I'm obese now, nor did I feel obese when I was heavier.  Yet I have almost 25 lbs to go before I'm even in the overweight range.  My point is, I wonder how many Americans hear reports on the health risks associated with obesity, and think "That doesn't apply to me- I'm just a little overweight.  I'm not ginormous, and I'm never going to be a supermodel, so my weight's probably fine."  There is a disconnect between clinical weight ranges and perceived weight ranges.  What is considered "normal" clinically is considered "skinny" in perception, what is considered "overweight" clinically is considered "normal" in perception, and what is considered "obese" clinically is considered "overweight" in perception. 

I think a lot of people ignore health risks because their weight doesn't seem so bad.  Although BMI is far from a true indicator of overall health and weight, I think a lot of Americans would get a rude awakening if they used it- not to find that there are so many obese people...but to find that they are likely one of them.

I disagree that eating healthy is more expensive, it's just a marketing ploy that makes people think it is but in the end you spend more on crap. Take for instance that I can get a pound of apples for under a dollar while a pound of potato chips will cost over $2. A pound of ground beef can be stretch by adding TVP and you won't notice much difference.

If you only buy organic and whole foods you will pay through the nose but if you buy reasonable items at your super market it's cheaper. Think about it for a second: how can you pay LESS for something that is processed? You can't, but you get so little real food in the "cheap" crap that to get real nutrition you would pay several times more.

Make your own soups, stews and chilli like your grandmother did and you will save a lot.

A few answers:

merylwhite1: 
Based on CDC data, "68 percent of adults and nearly one-third of children are considered at least overweight, with a body mass index of 25 or higher," from The New York Times, Obesity Rates Hit Plateau in U.S., Data Suggest

bethmania:
WHO (World Health Organization) weight classifications:
BMI 19 - 24 (healthy weight)
BMI 25 - 30 (overweight)
BMI 30 - 35  Class I (obesity)
BMI 35 - 40 Class II (severe obesity)
BMI ≥ 40 Class III (extreme obesity)

I could care less about this entire article, except for the first line.  

"As if the toll on health and beauty wasn't reason enough to lose weight, let’s not forget about the pocketbook."

It pisses me off that the person who wrote this thinks that just because you are over weight makes you ugly. I, for one am beautiful, and so are many other over weight, obese and fat people. 

Original Post by: xeef

Health care costs and missed work, while significant, are just the tip of the financial iceberg.

I did not realize how much I was spending extra on clothes, for example, until I lost enough weight to buy at retail stores.  Perhaps as much as $1000 a year for the exact same things, and I dont buy that many clothes.

Not to mention the damage being large did to my career advancement and earning power.

Then I think about the money ive wasted on being comfortable in my surroundings when I just needed to drop weight. 

Losing 100 pounds actually has affected my gas mileage.  Not much, but its still extra money.

Add it all up, and it dwarfs the cost of losing the weight.

I am exactly in your position!!! Bigger clothes means more money to buy, more money to wash, since you can fit less in a load, more money to iron (starch, steam and electricity). You mentioned retail stores. Many of the stores have the size 16 and up at a couple dollars more than 14's and below.

Damage to my self esteem and confidence has really cost me advancement in my career, not to mention most look at obese people as lazy in the corporate world, even if you aren't.

I have saves hundreds in the last couple of months just by not eating out every day. I used to eat 2 meals a day at fast food or casual dining restaurants.

*sigh* You know, this bugs me because while I am obese I do not have additional health costs. I visit my doctor once a year for a physical. I rarely get sick with flus or colds. I maybe have pain in joints but since i know what causes it I don't run to the doctor. I do have a shoulder injury, but that's caused by an actual injury, not a fat belly. So it bugs me when the stereotype is made that all obese and overweight people are draining the healthcare system.

In addition ... 5'5" and 150 is overweight? By god ... the BMI system is SO stupid and antiquated.  Not everyone has the same bone structure so they are going to have a different healthy weight. My one sister is 5'5" and 150 and completely in shape (law enforcement doesn't let you get fat - at least the le that she is with). But apparently she's "overweight".

If our country is faced with additional costs for obesity then the insurance WE personally pay for should ALL include benefits for medical procedures to help people who are morbidly obese loose weight. I don't feel insurance should cover personal trainers or gyms but a proactive approach of offering instruction in nutrition and exercise would be beneficial for everyone. I chose to loose weight by counting calories and exercising and it is working (60 down 60 to go). However, I know people who (for whatever reason) just can't do it on their own; they need medical assistance. 

It will be interesting to watch mega business monopolies go up against each other.  I kind of like the visual of Coca Cola, McDonalds and FritoLay taking on the Multimillion dollar health insurance industry.  Do the junk food industries pay health insurance for their employees?  Now there's a conundrum... 

Wanting insurance companies pay us or the US junk food market to back off are both reasonable expectations, to a point...but in the end it's got to be a personal choice of what you want and what it's worth to you.  

Just note: My Blue Cross Blue Shield policy doesn't complete cover a gym, but they do have a special membership fee agreement with YMCA, Curves and a few other select gyms. Unfortunately, none are even close to me yet, but they will be negotiating for more. This is a new benefit for them, so they haven't even been able to contact and get agreements with all gyms.

I'm just glad to see that at least once insurance carrier seems to be trying to help.

I don't spend a whole lot more on healthy foods than I used to on junk.  Chances are if you are ordering something off the dollar menu at McDonald's then you are ordering more than one item off of it and it comes out to 2 or 3 dollars anyway.

I get my Ready Pac salads (because I am far too busy to make salads every day for lunch) from Costco.  They are 4 to a box.  They last for a week, break down to $2.50 each, under 290 calories, are easy and really GOOD.  That's way less than most any fast food lunches.  If I made the salad at home it would be even cheaper.

If you buy a loaf of bread, turkey, low fat cheese, lettuce, tomatoes, mustard, etc. and make yourself sandwiches for lunch for two weeks - I pretty much guarantee it'll come out to less than fast food lunches especially if you shop at Costco or Sam's Club and buy in bulk.  Then you only have to refresh produce and meats every week and a half or something.  It'll come out to less than $3 for lunch. 

A big bag of mandarin oranges are $5.99.  If you have two of them for a snack then it's about .50  cents a snack.  Bananas are 1-2 dollars for a bunch.  Bags of apples are relativesly inexpensive.  Potatoes are CHEAP and good for you if you aren't piling them with sour cream and butter.

Sometimes it takes some creativity but it's really not that incredibly difficult to make eating healthier a possiblity and affordable.

I certainly agree that if healthy eating is a priority for you, it can fit into your budget (just like being active will fit into your schedule). That being said, as a university student living in northern(ish) Canada, fresh produce and dairy products are quite pricey - I buy a lot of frozen veggies and buy in bulk to save $$.

I was interested to see the map posted on Canadian vs American obesity rates.

As someone who has always been in the "healthy" BMI range (on a sidenote, there are obviously exceptions to the scale - for example, extremely muscular or atheltic individuals), I am just as irritated by the money poured into healthcare to combat problems caused by obesity as I am to see it used to treat smokers or alcoholics. Add to that accomadations made by various industries (clothing, airlines, etc) and it is easy to see why rising rates of obesity are an economic problem, not just a social one...

Eating healthy is not that expensive. I eat 3 meals and a snack everyday for around 7$ a day. That is one meal for me at Mcdonalds. I even buy quite a bit of organic produce. Stocking your kitchen with the cooking staples can seem a bit pricey after years of kitchen neglect, but that stuff lasts forever and it is so nice to be able to come home and whip something up with stuff you have already in your house:) Learn to cook and learn to budget and eating healthy will actually become cheaper and more satisfying than a fast fake food meal any day.

I'm compelled to put in my 2 cents on this conversation.

First off, it does not cost more to eat healthy if you are smart about it: buy fruits and veggies in season, buy whole grains, and buy local. Second, don't purchase pre-packaged, processed foods as well as convenience food, aka fast food. . If the public doesn't buy this garbage which would have the consumer believe it is healthy and convenient (of which it is neither), believe me, the Food Industry will take notice and stop selling this unhealthy stuff. Finally, stop the excuses: get off your butt and exercise! Our sedentary lifestyle is killing us. If we make exercise a non-negotiable part of our day (along the lines of breathing), not only would people be healthier, we would cause a change in our societal norms. Gee, could you imagine a society where physical activity is venerated? How about one that values good nutrition and sees it as a best prevention against the chronic disease which result from malnutrition and obesity?

I think what is all comes down to is making a conscious change as a people to change our lifestyle, our values around food and exercise and ultimately a change in our social structure as well as our economy. If we as a Nation stop subsidizing some of these industries which produce High Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS), meat products which make us ill, and fruits and vegetables free fom pesticides, we'd be well on our way to creating a healthy, sustainable economy.

I'm 34, 5'4 and started out weighing 187lbs in the obese BMI category. Unfortunately due to the weight gain I had high blood pressure, high cholesterol, GERD and pre-diabettes. Talk about metabolic syndrome here we come!!! Oh My Goodness....my medicine cabinet looked like a pharmacy shelf and I was in and out of the doctors office all the time.

Thankfully I lost 45lbs and am now at my BMI. I'm no longer pre-diabettic, my cholesterol is back to normal so no more statins, my GERD is finally under control and I'm on a lower dosage of blood pressure meds. And yes talk about the savings....it pays to lose weight not only for your health but for your pocketbook as well. I wish I would have done this sooner.

Does anyone remember the human world creating in Wall-E by no physical activity?

Original Post by: mcapito

I'm 34, 5'4 and started out weighing 187lbs in the obese BMI category. Unfortunately due to the weight gain I had high blood pressure, high cholesterol, GERD and pre-diabettes. Talk about metabolic syndrome here we come!!! Oh My Goodness....my medicine cabinet looked like a pharmacy shelf and I was in and out of the doctors office all the time.

Thankfully I lost 45lbs and am now at my BMI. I'm no longer pre-diabettic, my cholesterol is back to normal so no more statins, my GERD is finally under control and I'm on a lower dosage of blood pressure meds. And yes talk about the savings....it pays to lose weight not only for your health but for your pocketbook as well. I wish I would have done this sooner.

Thank you!!!! I didn't even consider the GERD going away! I've already been able to cut my asthma meds and taking Advil every day for arthritis. I've had GERD so long, I never even thought about it.

I wish that good intentions were enough.  Insurance companies, however, exist only for the "health" of their shareholders.

AARP says that doctors don't spend time counseling patients on exercise, weight loss or smoking cessation 'because these [treatments] are not billable.'  So if it doesn't have a diagnostic code it won't get done by the medical establishment.  Doctors won't spend time doing good deeds if they are not reimbursed by insurance.

So, it is not a disease if you sit around all day eating and smoking.  You just die sooner. It makes me wonder how good our definition of 'disease' really is.

I think that having insurance companies provide a kickback for losing weight is obsurd.  Even worse the idea that we should be paid to be healthy, did they cause you to be overweight.  We should take care of ourselves because we are our own responsibility.  I was taken aback by the comments that the healthcare industry should reimburse ppl for living healthy lives.  The healthcare industry makes its money on ppl who pay for health insurance for health matters that are out of their control and rarely need to use it.  If ppl took better care of themselves the cost of healthcare would decrease and bring down the price of premiums and ease the burden of ppl who make the conscious effort to manage their health.  We cannot allow ourselves to continue to rely on others to be responsible to fix the problems that we have caused. 

While I'll agree that healthy eating is Slightly more expensive then junkier eating, it out rages me Reading about people pointing fingers as to health care costs.

I don't have ANY health care costs. I don't hardly ever get sick so I never have to go to a doctor. And I think people now a days run to the doctor way too much. Taking antibiotics every time they have a cold so their body will never learn to fight things on its own.

The finger could also be pointed in many directions, but it seems to be the 'fad' to jump on fat people about their weight... What about people with EDs? Or athletes(who get injured, then need PT, surgery etc).

How about just encouraging people WITHOUT blaming them? I don't blame any person(or group) at the bottom level.  The costs are driven by peoples pocket books. I don't personally care about what any one gets paid but lets be honest. INS companies all get paid big bucks, Doctors make quite a bit(I have a doctor friend who makes 21K a month... Honest.)... The lab techs, etc. Doctors offices have big overhang costs so that gets passed on to everyone else. Money in pocket books is a huge factor, not just someones weight(or lack there of).

And It seems to be all very thin people 'complaining' about heavy people.. How about minding your own business? Who are you to judge? You don't pay for my health care or anyone elses but your own. And unless your willing to help over weight people learn the correct ways you need to personally stay out of it.

Ins companies Should offer help to those that need it. The reason a lot of people are over weight is their parents didn't teach them how to eat, what to eat, etc. Kids grew up eating like their parents, and now teach their children to eat the same way... Some people just need a little more help than others...

My mother fed us ckicken nuggets, mac and cheese, hot dogs, fries, pasta(and not much else) our whole lives. I had no idea what a calorie really was or what an actual serving size was until last year. I am learning as much as I can on my own and losing the weight on my own, but some professional help would be hugely welcomed.

For all of you who think 5'5" and 150 pounds is normal have clearly been in North America too long. I know that its harsh, but go to places like South Africa, Italy, Greece, South America, Bahamas etc and jut take a look at their people. I'm talking about first world countries that have enough food, just like North America.

I've spent my life traveling the world and North America is fat. Simply put. We have become so used to seeing overweight people that that is now considered "healthy". The only reason I'm saying this is because last year I went to South Africa for six months. When I arrived I was 5'5" and 145 pounds and very active. I thought I was hot, not once did I ever think I was over weight. Once I arrived in South Africa I realized that I was usually the heaviest person in the room (height proportional to weight). Even the woman in their 40's/50's/60's etc were well kept and slim. (Healthy not grossly thin.) By the time I got back I was, well still 5'5" :), but 125 pounds. I had never had never been so energetic in  my life. I felt great!

The first thing I noticed when I arrived back in Canada was the food and portion size. I was sickened! Our apples are three times as big and anywhere else in the world, our pizza portions could normally serve three in another country, etc. 

I realized that I had become so used so my size in comparison to everyone else that I never looked at myself through the world's eyes. I'm not here to comment on health care, but to encourage everyone from North America, (Canada too) to look at themselves one day, stop defending their fat and do something about it. I struggle with this every day. I must say to myself, "In Canada you are normal, but what does the world see you as?" This is so important to me because I do spend a lot of my time traveling and I hate it when people see me and say "you must be from North America" .

We have only ourselves to blame for the obesity stereotype.

Sorry that its so so long.... :)

I'm interested to hear everyone's thoughts. 

Original Post by: wychofavalon

I don't spend a whole lot more on healthy foods than I used to on junk.  Chances are if you are ordering something off the dollar menu at McDonald's then you are ordering more than one item off of it and it comes out to 2 or 3 dollars anyway.

I get my Ready Pac salads (because I am far too busy to make salads every day for lunch) from Costco.  They are 4 to a box.  They last for a week, break down to $2.50 each, under 290 calories, are easy and really GOOD.  That's way less than most any fast food lunches.  If I made the salad at home it would be even cheaper.

If you buy a loaf of bread, turkey, low fat cheese, lettuce, tomatoes, mustard, etc. and make yourself sandwiches for lunch for two weeks - I pretty much guarantee it'll come out to less than fast food lunches especially if you shop at Costco or Sam's Club and buy in bulk.  Then you only have to refresh produce and meats every week and a half or something.  It'll come out to less than $3 for lunch. 

A big bag of mandarin oranges are $5.99.  If you have two of them for a snack then it's about .50  cents a snack.  Bananas are 1-2 dollars for a bunch.  Bags of apples are relativesly inexpensive.  Potatoes are CHEAP and good for you if you aren't piling them with sour cream and butter.

Sometimes it takes some creativity but it's really not that incredibly difficult to make eating healthier a possiblity and affordable.

Ooh. My best buy at Costco is in the freezer section - Shrimp Wonton Soup. They are only like 110 or 120 calories a bowl and only 2 g of fat. I eat before my meal at lunch or sometimes at dinner and end up eating less of the big meal. They are delicious. I think it's $8 or $9 for a box of 8 individual bowls.

Good for a snack too when you know you need to eat, but maybe not starving.

Original Post by: hetznutz2

If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

Not a chance.  Insurance companies lobby for the use of BMI despite the fact that the BMI system is the most illogical, outdated piece of dog feces, because as long as more people are 'overweight or obese', they can make more money of off them.

Case in point, I have several friends who work-out often, they have a BF% < 7%, and yet because they are tall/very muscular/dense bones, they are overweight or even obese by BMI standards.

It's ridiculous.

Original Post by: chubaka2

Original Post by: hetznutz2

If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

Not a chance.  Insurance companies lobby for the use of BMI despite the fact that the BMI system is the most illogical, outdated piece of dog feces, because as long as more people are 'overweight or obese', they can make more money of off them.

Case in point, I have several friends who work-out often, they have a BF% < 7%, and yet because they are tall/very muscular/dense bones, they are overweight or even obese by BMI standards.

It's ridiculous.

I agree that BMI is very much useless for individuals, but being very tall doesn't affect BMI. Also, a lot of people come up with amazingly absurd numbers for their BF%. One of my friends swore he was 7% but couldn't see his abs. Guess what? He was more like 18% when I put calipers on him. There is a huge difference between the two. If you don't have a full 6 pack at 7% you aren't, but he didn't want to believe it. Mean while, me at 14% could see all but a bit of my bottom 2 abs and he had NO visible abs.

Original Post by: kajungirltn

Original Post by: wychofavalon

I don't spend a whole lot more on healthy foods than I used to on junk.  Chances are if you are ordering something off the dollar menu at McDonald's then you are ordering more than one item off of it and it comes out to 2 or 3 dollars anyway.

I get my Ready Pac salads (because I am far too busy to make salads every day for lunch) from Costco.  They are 4 to a box.  They last for a week, break down to $2.50 each, under 290 calories, are easy and really GOOD.  That's way less than most any fast food lunches.  If I made the salad at home it would be even cheaper.

If you buy a loaf of bread, turkey, low fat cheese, lettuce, tomatoes, mustard, etc. and make yourself sandwiches for lunch for two weeks - I pretty much guarantee it'll come out to less than fast food lunches especially if you shop at Costco or Sam's Club and buy in bulk.  Then you only have to refresh produce and meats every week and a half or something.  It'll come out to less than $3 for lunch. 

A big bag of mandarin oranges are $5.99.  If you have two of them for a snack then it's about .50  cents a snack.  Bananas are 1-2 dollars for a bunch.  Bags of apples are relativesly inexpensive.  Potatoes are CHEAP and good for you if you aren't piling them with sour cream and butter.

Sometimes it takes some creativity but it's really not that incredibly difficult to make eating healthier a possiblity and affordable.

Ooh. My best buy at Costco is in the freezer section - Shrimp Wonton Soup. They are only like 110 or 120 calories a bowl and only 2 g of fat. I eat before my meal at lunch or sometimes at dinner and end up eating less of the big meal. They are delicious. I think it's $8 or $9 for a box of 8 individual bowls.

Good for a snack too when you know you need to eat, but maybe not starving.

Really??  I will look into those because I'm heading to Costco tonight!!  I have to pick up some "Skinny Cows" too!

Thanks for the heads up!

That was my point exactly lerouxm- thank you for giving such a great example.  Americans and Canadians are never going to have society-wide change because, as you said, "We have become so used to seeing overweight people that that is now considered "healthy"." 

The message is out there that obesity is dangerous and unhealthy, but the problem is that few people understand they themselves are obese. 

Congratulations on your weight loss and good luck in maintenance!

HAHA. In summer, I like the Healthy Choice Fudge Bars there too. YUM! 90 calories, I think. Just too cold right now. LOL

Wow, reading this thread is very interesting, and I'm going to add a few more comments. For those in this discussion that think that the "skinnies" are ganging up on those who are not, think again. As one who just got got booted from health insurance due to a redux in my work hours, I live in real fear of getting ill. I'm no spring chicken and I eat healthy, I exercise, I take the supplements I can afford to keep those chronic diseases away....and for what reason? To find out that COBRA (health coverage from my previous employer) is going to cost me nearly $600.00 a month? Meanwhile, all those insured and non-insured who can't seem to get control of their dietary and exercise habits are making the costs of adequate medical care higher for all us. With this uncertain economy, and tenciously trying to hold onto our jobs, the problem of obesity is costing all of us: those who have to pay higher premiums, those who are uninsured and sick with a chronic disease resultant from the malnutrition of obesity, and those of us recently uninsured and wondering what in the world we are going to do if and when we really get sick.  

Hey folks, something has to change here, and it's more than just individual lifestyle; we really need to re-think about how our food systems work here in the US and what we need to do ensure they stop making us sick.

"...but it seems to be the 'fad' to jump on fat people about their weight... What about people with EDs? Or athletes(who get injured, then need PT, surgery etc)."

By "EDs" do you mean eating disorders? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought obesity is an eating disorder, along with anorexia, etc? It just effects a larger % of the population. Also (speaking as a Canadian) my tax dollars DO pay for others healthcare - I am happy to contribute, but I think it is each individuals responsibility to stay healthy and active. It is completely different to end up in the hospital because of obesity or smoking than because you strained a tendon as an athlete!

Also, great comment about looking at obesity on a global level! I completely agree. I love going to visit my family in Europe because they all enjoy eating, it is not the "sin" that some people in NA seem to turn it into...

My obesity started with becoming sick and the inablity to get around much.  Then there were the medications some of which also caused more weight gain.

My mom is 77 has been over weight since she was a child (I was not).  She has lost weight, as much as a 100+ lbs. at a time, only to gain it back.  She has high blood pressure.  Other wise she is in pretty good shape.  She will out live me.

"It is better to pay the grocer than the doctor."

As Michael Pollan points out in his books, the more Americans spend on food, the less we spend on healthcare. Conversely, the less we spend on food, the more we spend on healthcare.

Healthy food doesn't have to be more expensive, but it will take extra work. Farmer's markets are cheaper, although you might have to visit a few different ones to get everything you want or need.

I try to go that route, but when I feel lazy I just go to Whole Foods. It is a little more expensive, but I've decided to sacrifice in other areas of my life so I can eat better foods. If you vote for better quality products with your dollars you will create a demand. As a result, our food producers will have to change their practices and subsequently prices will fall.

Just my opinion :)

I agree mostly.  Except that I think this idea is used by some people to beat down any healthcare reform..basically blaming the patient for the high cost of healthcare.

Also agree that healthy food costs more, but if I'm going to pay either way, I'd rather spend the money on being healthy and not the diseases obesity causes.

Original Post by: arielgirl

I agree mostly.  Except that I think this idea is used by some people to beat down any healthcare reform..basically blaming the patient for the high cost of healthcare.

Also agree that healthy food costs more, but if I'm going to pay either way, I'd rather spend the money on being healthy and not the diseases obesity causes.

And when you are talking about the high cost of healthy food, you are only talking about money. When you consider the costs of obesity, you not only have to worry about the money, but the other "costs" such as dying earlier, becoming bedridden, not being able to complete daily activities like other adults and what about quality of life?

To me, the "costs" of obesity fat outweigh what I could spend at Whole Foods or the Farmer's market.

Original Post by: chubaka2

Original Post by: hetznutz2

If there is such an immense savings to be had from obese Americans losing weight, then perhaps the insurance industry should supply some monetary assistance in our weight loss efforts. 

Not a chance.  Insurance companies lobby for the use of BMI despite the fact that the BMI system is the most illogical, outdated piece of dog feces, because as long as more people are 'overweight or obese', they can make more money of off them.

Case in point, I have several friends who work-out often, they have a BF% < 7%, and yet because they are tall/very muscular/dense bones, they are overweight or even obese by BMI standards.

It's ridiculous.

As an unemployed scientist, I have nothing but time to micromanage my food budget and calorie count.  And I have several things to say. 

The first:  YES, the BMI system is crap, because while it does take height into account it doesn't take into account the size of your frame.  Our frames depend on more than mere wrist size.  What about those of us who have skinny wrists but wide hip bones?  For example, I am classified as "overweight."  Yes, I have a few vanity pounds to lose around the belly and  very tops of my thighs, but over seven months I have grown an inch to 5'7'', gone up a cup size in bras, and dropped a pant size.  My hip bones have literally grown wider.  I kid you not, at 27 I got growing pains in my bones!  And apparently I have been adding muscle and boob at the same rate I've lost fat, because my pants are still fitting looser and looser but I've weighed 165 lb for the past three months.  I can do hours of hard cardio, I don't have weight-related injuries, and I'm rarely sick.  I have skinny but toned arms and muscular legs, with just some saddlebags and a little bit of love handle left, and as I'm losing weight you can see my abs emerging.  I gun it in the spin classes and feel great afterward.  So I'm not buying that I'm at more of a health risk.  Nor do I buy that I'm "fat".  I'm normal, if not above average for fitness and health!

The second rant:  Depending on how you're trying to lose weight, it may not be cheaper to eat healthier.  If you only reduce your eating habits, and eat 1200-1500 cal to lose weight, you'll get skinny but have no muscle mass.  You know, eat granola and fruits and veggies and very little else or eat tiny portions of normal food.  And for some people, that's okay. 

But if you aim to lose weight and gain muscle and get in shape for your favorite activities, you can even end up eating more food than you did before you started the diet.  And that's where the money comes in.  For example, in order to eat enough calories to let me exercise as much as I like to, I have to eat 1800-2200 cal.  Rather than eating unhealthy food to get to this total faster, I cook soups and vegetable dishes and eat lean game meats and lowfat curries and Asian foods.  I never eat out.  But in order to reach the total, I need to eat a lot of low-cal foods.  So I'm buying fruits and veggies in mass amounts, and I eat lots of venison and fish and goat and lamb.  Believe me, this adds up.  One can't live entirely off of veggies from farmer's markets.  Nuts aren't cheap, and neither is granola, when you're unemployed and supporting a spouse.  Cheese and milk aren't cheap.  With both my husband and I on this high-exercise, healthy eating diet, we can't afford to go to movies or go out on dates or even drive more than 15 miles away from home. 

If we were to eat fast food twice a day, every day of the week, we'd be spending $70 a week.  However, on our current healthy diet, we often spend $100-$120 a week for two people.  If we ate pizza and burgers and crap every day, we'd save $120-$200 a month.  And believe me, we shop as cheap as possible for produce and meat.  I even calculate gas mileage to determine whether driving further for cheaper food is profitable.  Those are hard numbers, people.  They don't lie. 

The moral:  It's a load of BS that having a few vanity pounds to shed makes you "fat."  It's a load of BS that you spend more on food when you aren't eating healthy.  Insurance companies are just so desperate because their industry has tanked that they'll try to squeeze money of of anyone they can.  (My husband, btw, worked in insurance before he got laid off.)