lysistrata

Posts by lysistrata


User's Posts | User's Topics


Forum Topic Date Replies
The Lounge obstruction of justice Sep 16 2014
15:51 (UTC)
8
Part of the rest son why prosecutors don't want law enforcement folks convicted of being lying liars is because then it calls into question their entire body of past work and all the convictions built on it.
The Lounge obstruction of justice Sep 16 2014
15:48 (UTC)
9
Obstructing is usually defined as something like "willfully delay or hinder a public official in the performance of an official duty." I don't know which official the lab hindered or which official duty was hindered ... The prosecutor, I guess? The thing is that while prosecutors are often eager to test out sweepingly broad and sometimes absurd theories of law against citizen defendants, they seem less eager to do so with their own teammates. I was just reading yesterday about some biology professor prosecuted for feeding a whale because she positioned the food it had already killed so she could see it better. You'd think with that kind of flexible reading it would be easy to prosecute a corrupt state lab scientist for perjury and obstructing.
The Lounge Blaming victims - Particularly Domestic Abuse Victims Sep 15 2014
19:48 (UTC)
15
there's "something broken" in all of us, her included, and that the only difference between somebody who gets abused and somebody who never does is that the former crosses paths with the **** who sees and exploits the something that's broken.

There are quite a few more differences. Everybody has encountered violent, manipulative, antisocial people. Not everybody gets or stays involved with them romantically.
The Lounge Blaming victims - Particularly Domestic Abuse Victims Sep 15 2014
19:15 (UTC)
19
Not buying it. Nor do I think it is particularly helpful to victims of domestic violence to suggest they were just unlucky, because all that does is suggest they will avoid the problem in the future if they have better luck. Abusive dynamics tend to be chronic and recurring. Yes, there is something wrong, or maladaptive, with people in abusive relationships. It doesn't make them bad people, or powerless to change. But I think nomo's description of her feelings of worthlessness illustrates perfectly that dysfunctional thinking is both conducive to abuse dynamics and fixable. Essentializing victimhood is both false and counterproductive.
The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 05 2014
17:35 (UTC)
136
Reason is totally legit. Even Melkor thinks so.
The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 04 2014
18:08 (UTC)
140

I found these two pieces to provide interesting counterpoints on the topic of systemic racism.

People are faster to shoot whites

Fear of being seen as racist is possibly as bad as directly victimizing people

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 03 2014
04:08 (UTC)
203
Original Post by pavlovcat:

There is not a single person here that I've seen say that racism doesn't exist.

There is not a single person here that I've seen that is saying the system isn't broken in some way.

I've already stated that there is a vicious cycle occurring in urban American black communities and that steps need to be taken at multiple levels to break that cycle.  But ultimately it comes down to parents making a conscious decision to raise their children to respect the law, value education, and make wise choices regarding safe sex (to decrease the number of children born to teen and unwed mothers).  Community programs can support them, but they can't initiate or force the change to occur. 

Community programs can feed the alienation if they aren't careful.

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 03 2014
03:54 (UTC)
204
Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:
incidentally, i live just four blocks from the main station of the vancouver police department. they drive through my neighbourhood, past my front door, more often than i can count. i jay-walk in front of cops on pretty much a daily basis. not once has one of them made a noise about it. i imagine it might be different if i were something other than a middle-class, middle-aged white woman.

I believe I mentioned in a previous post that officers very frequently will stop a civilian for minor infractions because that's a pretty reliable way of stumbling across people engaged in more serious crimes, especially in poor black neighborhoods.

The fact that the guys he yelled at for jaywalking just happened to have committed a strong-arm robbery would seem to bear out this rationale. 

I betcha if middle-class, middle-aged white women suddenly decided to commit a bunch of crimes in your neighborhood, you'd find the cops much more interested in your jaywalking behaviors.

and this, my dear, is what racism looks like.

Explain to me what a better system of policing looks like, considering that there is a higher crime rate in poor black neighborhoods.

Seriously.  What is the alternative to a heavier police presence in those areas and picking up people for lesser offenses? 

Well, here's the problem:

Last year, Ferguson police searched 12.1 percent of black drivers they stopped, compared to 6.9 percent for whites. Contraband was found 22 percent of the time when the driver was black and 34 percent when the driver was white.

So if they are going to racially profile, maybe they need to start pulling over more white people. And then maybe they'll start catching more of the white criminals, and maybe it'll change the stats on where the higher crime rates are.

That doesn't prove anything.  It doesn't even imply anything.  It's your interpretation that implies racism. 

Again, if patrols are heavier in higher crime neighborhoods and higher crime neighborhoods have a higher percentage of black people, more black people are likely to get pulled over.

Even the article stated that it's possible the white population is older in Ferguson and therefore less likely to be pulled over. 

In terms of the search rate, perhaps the black people pulled over were more likely to act confrontational or suspicious.  Perhaps they were more likely to have a police record (do those show up in the computer when the cops run a license?  I don't even know.)  And yes, perhaps the cops are letting their biases inform their decisions.  All possible explanations worthy of considering, but certainly not spelled out based on a couple of numbers.

Perhaps they're far less likely to say Officer, am I being detained??

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 03 2014
03:53 (UTC)
205
Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

cute. trite, but cute.

Your edit was slightly more concrete.  It would be great if we could afford to maintain police departments of such size that they could do team foot or bike patrols.  That's not the reality for most towns.

actually, community policing reduces crime and reduces the need for more intensive interventions. it takes fewer cops, not more.

but it reduces profits for private prisons, so there's that.

Immediately?  It immediately takes fewer cops?  Or it takes fewer cops after the program has been in place for a number of years? 

Sorry, but I don't buy that there's some conspiracy between the cops and the prisons.  Any police chief who could figure out the formula to dramatically and consistently lower the crime rate while also improving race relations would soon be the richest police chief in the country because every community would want to hire him or her.  No amount of kick-backs can top that.

kick-backs? who's the conspiracy theorist now?

less crime/fewer convictions --> less perceived need for law enforcement --> less funding for policing.

eta: not immediately, no. so we shouldn't do anything different, if--y'know--the payoff isn't immediate. 'cause what would be the point in that?

There are a few things I am more than willing to have my taxes raised for.  A well-trained, well-staffed police force is one of them.  I would be happy to shell out some cash for good ole beat cops, but try getting that past the rest of the local voters.

As for the whole prison/funding thing, it seems to me there's no conflict.  If increased foot patrols equals decreased crime which equals decreased convictions which equals decreased perception of need for cops which equals decreased funding which equals a smaller police force, that all seems to work out just fine, right?

Except that wouldn't be how it would happen.  As soon as the foot patrols were gone crime would increase again.  So the increased funding would have to be permanent, which is what I was getting at when I said that it's not feasible for the majority of police forces.  Therefore, they're stuck with heavy car patrol presence in rough neighborhoods and stopping people for minor infractions hoping to catch a big fish.

okay, then. keep sending under-educated, under-skilled white cops into poor black neighbourhoods to harass poor black kids who may or may not have stolen some cigars, and make sure those cops are afraid to get out of their cars and talk to people, because they (probably rightly) believe they're seen as threats and adversaries. oh - and make sure that arresting, charging, and convicting black people remains a profitable enterprise.

How many cops have you talked to about what they believe and how they feel?  How many cops have you asked what would help them better police black neighborhoods?

Fitness September 2014 Fitness Group-- ALL ARE WELCOME Sep 03 2014
03:42 (UTC)
157

Hit some tennis balls tonight.  No bagel, so my game is improving!  Came home and did NROL abs Phase 1, Workout A, sixth (last) time.  Played with one arm/one leg raise on the planks, stayed at 30 second on side plank but focused on form, hung for countable seconds on the chin up bar, backed the DL's back down to 80, otherwise unremarkable.

Miles: 9/60

Strength:  1/8

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 02 2014
23:14 (UTC)
236
Original Post by rosencrantz12:

Original Post by lysistrata:

Original Post by rosencrantz12:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:
incidentally, i live just four blocks from the main station of the vancouver police department. they drive through my neighbourhood, past my front door, more often than i can count. i jay-walk in front of cops on pretty much a daily basis. not once has one of them made a noise about it. i imagine it might be different if i were something other than a middle-class, middle-aged white woman.

I believe I mentioned in a previous post that officers very frequently will stop a civilian for minor infractions because that's a pretty reliable way of stumbling across people engaged in more serious crimes, especially in poor black neighborhoods.

The fact that the guys he yelled at for jaywalking just happened to have committed a strong-arm robbery would seem to bear out this rationale. 

I betcha if middle-class, middle-aged white women suddenly decided to commit a bunch of crimes in your neighborhood, you'd find the cops much more interested in your jaywalking behaviors.

and this, my dear, is what racism looks like.

Explain to me what a better system of policing looks like, considering that there is a higher crime rate in poor black neighborhoods.

Seriously.  What is the alternative to a heavier police presence in those areas and picking up people for lesser offenses? 

Well, here's the problem:

Last year, Ferguson police searched 12.1 percent of black drivers they stopped, compared to 6.9 percent for whites. Contraband was found 22 percent of the time when the driver was black and 34 percent when the driver was white.

So if they are going to racially profile, maybe they need to start pulling over more white people. And then maybe they'll start catching more of the white criminals, and maybe it'll change the stats on where the higher crime rates are.

 

Anybody read this? Or is it just easier to ignore it?

Do you have a suggestion about what we are to take away from it?

If the police are profiling young black drivers, they're probably profiling young black jaywalkers. Of course, that only works if you're not denying the race issue. 

 

Racial profiling has been established for a long time.  The problem is that police work on risk assessment, which takes probabilities into account.  And so the problem is that it would make sense to profile minority communities if there is more criminal activity in those communities.  The factors that increase likelihood of police contact across race include poverty, having a parent or sibling arrested, having disciplinary actions in school, being in an environment where law breaking is positively reinforced, and proximity to drug-using adults.  One thing we might be asking is why these conditions are more prevalent in black and hispanic communities than in white or asian ones.

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 02 2014
22:16 (UTC)
241
Original Post by rosencrantz12:

Original Post by amethystgirl:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:
incidentally, i live just four blocks from the main station of the vancouver police department. they drive through my neighbourhood, past my front door, more often than i can count. i jay-walk in front of cops on pretty much a daily basis. not once has one of them made a noise about it. i imagine it might be different if i were something other than a middle-class, middle-aged white woman.

I believe I mentioned in a previous post that officers very frequently will stop a civilian for minor infractions because that's a pretty reliable way of stumbling across people engaged in more serious crimes, especially in poor black neighborhoods.

The fact that the guys he yelled at for jaywalking just happened to have committed a strong-arm robbery would seem to bear out this rationale. 

I betcha if middle-class, middle-aged white women suddenly decided to commit a bunch of crimes in your neighborhood, you'd find the cops much more interested in your jaywalking behaviors.

and this, my dear, is what racism looks like.

Explain to me what a better system of policing looks like, considering that there is a higher crime rate in poor black neighborhoods.

Seriously.  What is the alternative to a heavier police presence in those areas and picking up people for lesser offenses? 

Well, here's the problem:

Last year, Ferguson police searched 12.1 percent of black drivers they stopped, compared to 6.9 percent for whites. Contraband was found 22 percent of the time when the driver was black and 34 percent when the driver was white.

So if they are going to racially profile, maybe they need to start pulling over more white people. And then maybe they'll start catching more of the white criminals, and maybe it'll change the stats on where the higher crime rates are.

 

Anybody read this? Or is it just easier to ignore it?

Do you have a suggestion about what we are to take away from it?

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 02 2014
19:30 (UTC)
259
Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by lysistrata:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:
incidentally, i live just four blocks from the main station of the vancouver police department. they drive through my neighbourhood, past my front door, more often than i can count. i jay-walk in front of cops on pretty much a daily basis. not once has one of them made a noise about it. i imagine it might be different if i were something other than a middle-class, middle-aged white woman.

I believe I mentioned in a previous post that officers very frequently will stop a civilian for minor infractions because that's a pretty reliable way of stumbling across people engaged in more serious crimes, especially in poor black neighborhoods.

The fact that the guys he yelled at for jaywalking just happened to have committed a strong-arm robbery would seem to bear out this rationale. 

I betcha if middle-class, middle-aged white women suddenly decided to commit a bunch of crimes in your neighborhood, you'd find the cops much more interested in your jaywalking behaviors.

and this, my dear, is what racism looks like.

Explain to me what a better system of policing looks like, considering that there is a higher crime rate in poor black neighborhoods.

Seriously.  What is the alternative to a heavier police presence in those areas and picking up people for lesser offenses? 

how about not using skin colour as evidence of criminal behaviour? how about not confusing poverty with a crime? how about seeing criminals as individuals rather than as types?

That's not a community policing strategy, that's a John Lennon song.

*snort*

I suspect that until middle age white women start adopting cultural norms that promote violence, weapons, "street cred," gang affiliation, pimping out btches and racial solidarity, policing will probably continue to emphasize the higher risk areas and individuals.

and that distinction couldn't possibly have anything to do with 400 years of racism and white privilege.

Go hang out at a Crip party and tell me more about it.

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 02 2014
19:25 (UTC)
263
Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:

Original Post by pavlovcat:

Original Post by theviewfromhere:
incidentally, i live just four blocks from the main station of the vancouver police department. they drive through my neighbourhood, past my front door, more often than i can count. i jay-walk in front of cops on pretty much a daily basis. not once has one of them made a noise about it. i imagine it might be different if i were something other than a middle-class, middle-aged white woman.

I believe I mentioned in a previous post that officers very frequently will stop a civilian for minor infractions because that's a pretty reliable way of stumbling across people engaged in more serious crimes, especially in poor black neighborhoods.

The fact that the guys he yelled at for jaywalking just happened to have committed a strong-arm robbery would seem to bear out this rationale. 

I betcha if middle-class, middle-aged white women suddenly decided to commit a bunch of crimes in your neighborhood, you'd find the cops much more interested in your jaywalking behaviors.

and this, my dear, is what racism looks like.

Explain to me what a better system of policing looks like, considering that there is a higher crime rate in poor black neighborhoods.

Seriously.  What is the alternative to a heavier police presence in those areas and picking up people for lesser offenses? 

how about not using skin colour as evidence of criminal behaviour? how about not confusing poverty with a crime? how about seeing criminals as individuals rather than as types?

That's not a community policing strategy, that's a John Lennon song.

*snort*

I suspect that until middle age white women start adopting cultural norms that promote violence, weapons, "street cred," gang affiliation, pimping out btches and racial solidarity, policing will probably continue to emphasize the higher risk areas and individuals.

The Lounge Michael Brown death by cop Sep 02 2014
18:46 (UTC)
278
Original Post by theviewfromhere:

but we'll never know if the officer would have yelled him for jay-walking if he were white, will we? that's the problem with racism; it's so much bigger than any single incident can ever account.

No, that's the problem with counterfactual arguments.

The Lounge ISIS (or ISIL) Sep 02 2014
18:00 (UTC)
6

Now Steven Sotloff.

Foods polenta Sep 02 2014
05:39 (UTC)
3
My favorite is to mix in a little salsa and cheese.
Fitness September 2014 Fitness Group-- ALL ARE WELCOME Sep 01 2014
20:48 (UTC)
169

Happy Labor day folks!  This month my challenge is going to be two weeks on vacation!  We fly to Vancouver Friday, get on the boat Saturday, disembark in Whittier on the following Saturday, ride buses and trains from Kenai up to Denali until the following Friday, and then fly back home on Sunday.  I expect to finish NROL Abs Phase I before we leave and then I'll see if the gym on the boat lets me start Phase II or if I just make do with what I have and start Phase II when we get home.  I booked a couple of shore excursions already, one hike in Ketchikan and a glacier hike in Juneau, and I will definitely want to kayak at Kenai NP once we're on land.  Soooo looking forward to the trip!

Started off the month with an awesome long run.  Resting really made a huge difference; I had lots of energy, did a couple of flat sprints and a couple of hill sprints and put a lot of miles down on the dirt trail.  I really think the strength workouts are helping me run better too.  Still working out the right balance of running, resting, lifting and eating, but generally happy with the trend.

Miles:  9/60

Strength:  0/8

Vegetarian Protein? Getting started on being vegetarian... Aug 30 2014
20:31 (UTC)
1

There's been quite a few studies on vegetarian health going on over quite a few years.  While, like in any extensive course of study, the results aren't always perfectly consistent and definitive, generally the studies show pretty consistently that a vegetarian diet is rarely less healthy than a nonvegetarian one.

Vegetarian Protein? Getting started on being vegetarian... Aug 30 2014
20:17 (UTC)
2

And just in case you thought that was an anomaly.

Advertisement
Advertisement