Rant at the naturally skinny, from the fatty perspective.

I'm not trying to mean. I know not every skinny person falls into this category. Not even most. But allow me, as a fat person, to vent my frustration at the inappropriate things slim people say. I'm a college student (for 35 more days!) so I talk to new people all the time (and I've been collecting these statements for a few years now), and I'm a little amazed at what's appropriate, or what I get singled out for over slimmer people at the same table. Here is my sarcasm-laden rant,:

Just because I am fat does not mean I want to have a conversation about how much you hate your sz 4 body. It does not mean I empathize with your intense emotional and mental struggle to take off the last 5 lbs to look good in your bikini. I can barely resist rolling my eyes when you tell me you 'understand' because you used to weigh 140, and (on your body) it made you look huge. I am so happy to hear that you were 'fat' when you weighed 100 lbs less than I do. I don't want to go with you to a great new store that doesn't carry my size. I do not automatically want to go out to get ice cream, cake, or candy, though I appreciate you thinking of me before the slimmer girls. I do not need your input or advice on what I'm eating for lunch. I do not want to hear about the crazy cabbage-soup-style diet your friend of a friend's mother in law lost 20 lbs on. I am completely uninterested in how horrible you think it would be to even be alive without eating sugar. I do not appreciate your gentle suggestion that maybe I should take up walking, because, honey, you couldn't keep up with my workout. Do not use the word willpower to me while you are eating chicken tenders and french fries. Being rude about my size is not justified by following it up with, 'I'm just concerned about your health.' I've got it, thanks. 'I'm sure it will fit, it's stretchy' is also not typically flattering to hear. I do not care in the slightest that you won't go to the gym with me because people might think you're fat. I am not impressed with your incredulous looks when I tell you I'm healthy. I do not want to talk about dieting. No nice statement ends with 'that bad' ('you don't look that bad'). I do not hate myself, my life, or my body, and the assumption that I should because I'm overweight just makes me fantasize about punching you in the face. I don't appreciate your disbelief at my 'eat healthy and exercise' plan. Vying for flattery from me by asking me if you look fat really just makes me wonder if you're trying to call me stupid. Mentioning my personality in a conversation about looks is not as artfully tactful as you seem to believe. My deepest, sincerest, apologies that it is so difficult for you to accept and believe that I am healthy and happy when I still have a good year before my body properly displays that. However, in the mean time, please shut up.

Original Post by x17star17x:

Original Post by jblarghp:

Yes, this is definitely a rare occurrence.

???

the three of us in agreement.

or, rather, me with the two of you

Original Post by luxdancer:

Original Post by x17star17x:

I also think that no matter what size you are that you can be obese. I know this is a bit off topic, but coming from someone that has lost a fair amount of weight here. Your brain never stops once you hit a certain size. If you are an over eater, you have to control your portions and be less than satisfied with those portions no matter your weight. Yo-yo dieter come to mind? You think if I eat a 1x1 inch brownie that I'll be satisfied? Pshhh! In my dreams. I want the whole dang thing! With ice cream and chocolate fudge on top. Indulgences.

Obesity is a state of mind. It just affects the body as you give in. But for me its so embeded into my brain it just won't quit.

So I'm 5'5, 120 pounds, and you can consider me OBESE. Eff the BMI charts.

Man, I'm totally the opposite way. I have to force myself to eat a proper portion or I won't eat anything at all. I'm at a healthy weight right now, but I'll probably always be mentally eating disordered.

And you were obese?

Original Post by pgeorgian:

Original Post by x17star17x:

Original Post by jblarghp:

Yes, this is definitely a rare occurrence.

???

the three of us in agreement.

or, rather, me with the two of you

I haven't been keeping up with CC in over 9 months. Took a mental break. I remember pgeorgian around the boards :) I'm back with truth and vengence!

Um, no. I was never obese, I am/was the other extreme.

I got onto this thread because of the title and I started posting because someone talked about "forgetting to eat being a special kind of stupid" - and I do forget to eat and I don't think it's necessarily because people are stupid.

Original Post by luxdancer:

Um, no. I was never obese, I am/was the other extreme.

I got onto this thread because of the title and I started posting because someone talked about "forgetting to eat being a special kind of stupid" - and I do forget to eat and I don't think it's necessarily because people are stupid.

If you were on the opposite end, I can see that as being natural. Your brain forgets to be hungry... I've skimmed that side of dieting too. Hence the reason I haven't been on CC in 9 months.

Some people just aren't that into food. My boyfriend for instance... Doesn't snack, forgets to eat lunch, not that hungry at dinner time, cravings are rare. but he is a normal weight... He grew up in a much different environment than I did. But at the end of the day he doesn't gain or lose, so those calories are coming from all the burger king he eats.

Original Post by pgeorgian:

clinically obese.  how's that?

i'm not interested in measuring or classifying people.  i'm just saying that obesity is not a natural state for any animal, human or otherwise.  it's a state that leads to disease and death.  and ranting about people who are "naturally skinny" as if that's some form of social retardation is pretty backwards.

Agreed. Being a healthy weight your whole life does not mean that you didn't have to work at it; being overweight your whole life does not mean it was genetically determined that you would be overweight. I think the vast majority of obesity is simply a result of poor lifestyle choices. I appreciate that lifestyle choices can be very hard to change, but for most people they are choices in the end.

This thread seems to have gone quite off topic: from one woman taking an opportunity to vent about her personal experiences to a debate over the etiology of obesity.

Whether obesity is pathological, natural, learned, innate, whatever doesn't really bear on the point of the OP: it is not enjoyable to be drawn into an unwanted conversation about one's body.  People with every body size or type should be able to recognize that some (most?) people don't want to feel socially obligated to talk to strangers about the details of their anatomy or physical health.  Yes, the OP was speaking to one iteration of this situation -- some skinny people who have been skinny their entire lives (which I take to be what is meant by 'naturally skinny') raising inappropriate topics of conversation to her regarding body size and health -- but it doesn't mean that it isn't a point that others can't at least attempt to appreciate, if not feel themselves. 

I agree with what someone upthread suggested; it seems increasingly as though any person on the forums who expresses their feelings or personal experience is summarily attacked for being 'wrong'.  Seems like every vent is taken for an invitation to fight...

you know what's a good way to avoid dissent?  keep your opinions private instead of airing them in a public forum.

I had really decided not to post here again, but I lack the self control (apparently some on the board could attribute this problem to my whole, 'I made myself fat' bit).

Dreadfulpenny: fabulous advice.

Luxdancer: Appreciate the comments, agree fully with many. My apologies for someone referring to meal-skippers as stupid, that was inappropriate, IMO.

Booster1: Always look forward to your posts, and appreciate that you completely get what I'm trying to say.

la-discotheque: read my replies, I'm not 'getting my bitch on' with anybody.

pgeorgian: Are you just here because you enjoy the drama? If you've read my replies, I have nothing against skinny people, I have a problem with rude people. The past few weeks, due to my particular situation, I've been getting a lot of it in the form ranted about. We may all be naturally 'healthy' but genetic differences in everything from weight distribution to metabolism makes that a pretty sweeping generalization. I gained most of my weight at college, I lived with 3 'naturally skinny' friends. We ate together, we did everything together. I gained 60 lbs, they stayed slim. I would therefore define them as more 'naturally skinny' than I am. Speaking of optimum state, I reject your darwinistic 'skinny people win' perception. People prone to obesity many times have a slower metabolism (or as I like to call it, a very 'efficient body'). They get more out of what they eat. From an evolutionary standpoint this would make them less susceptible to problems with food shortage and make them more likely to survive famine, thus making them the darwinistic optimum.

As for your list, yeah, some of it was rude. If my landlord gave me flowers, unless I was deathly allergic, I would thank her and dispose of the flowers after she left. I'm not complaining about these people because they're skinny, but because they are rude and its the only rudeness I'm dealing with on a regular basis atm. I'm not referring to the naturally skinny has having any retardation or any problem other than not always being aware of how a comment might come off to an overweight person.

And the genetic predisposition of obesity, shown even in adoption studies so that environment isn't a factor, is pretty well established.

Oh, and it's a forum, its a great place for opinions. Actually, its a motivation forum, so its a great place to express a rant that other people in a situation similar to mine deal with and also want to get off their chest. They did. They might still be if they weren't so concerned you would bite their head off for daring to not hate themselves at their horrible 'unnatural' condition.

I don't mind intellectual dissent, but it sounds like you have absolutely no idea where I was coming from or trying to say.

If you still think I was skinny bashing, start over and try again.

Original Post by minda_spk:

...People prone to obesity many times have a slower metabolism (or as I like to call it, a very 'efficient body'). They get more out of what they eat....

...And the genetic predisposition of obesity, shown even in adoption studies so that environment isn't a factor, is pretty well established...

The vast majority of people are not prone to anything. A very few people have true metabolic disorders, and everyone else is joining the bandwagon of "I can't do anything about it" because it's much more convenient... than doing something about it.

"Too many women are quick to blame their metabolism when those extra pounds refuse to come off. Not so fast. The idea that a low metabolic rate is always responsible for excess weight is just one of a number of misconceptions about metabolism, says researcher James Hill, Ph.D., director of the Center for Human Nutrition at the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center in Denver."

Caroline J. Cederquist, MD.

"Doctors and other health professionals often hear their patients complain of a slow metabolism, certain that they’re just not burning calories as efficiently as other people who eat the same amount.

Clinicians tend to think it’s more likely that patients are just mistaken about how much they’re actually eating. It’s hard to blame them if they’re a bit skeptical, as there’s a good body of research that shows that people both under-report their intake, and also honestly underestimate it."

From The Healthy Weights Clinic:

"Less than 1 in 1000 people experience weight related issues due to a metabolic abnormality. Further, these abnormalities are usually diagnosed early in a persons lifetime. So what is the problem with focusing on metabolism? The problem of course is that we fail to spend our hard earned effort on what really matters."

From the bbc.co.uk:

"The term 'metabolic rate' refers to the energy (calories) you expend over a day just keeping your body functioning - your heart beating and your lungs breathing, for example. This is often called the basal or resting metabolic rate.

Scientists have measured the exact amount of calories overweight and healthy weight people burn while sitting or lying quietly. This was done by measuring the amount of oxygen breathed in and the amount of carbon dioxide breathed out.

Results from these studies have consistently shown that overweight people use more energy to keep their bodies working. This is because they have larger bodies with bigger muscles and internal organs.

However, after taking into account differences in body size, lean and obese people have been shown to have similar metabolic rates."

Hmm... maybe it is lifestyle choice after all.

Original Post by minda_spk:

pgeorgian: Are you just here because you enjoy the drama?

why do you ask?

If you've read my replies, I have nothing against skinny people, I have a problem with rude people.

great.  so single out rude people in your title.

The past few weeks, due to my particular situation, I've been getting a lot of it in the form ranted about. We may all be naturally 'healthy' but genetic differences in everything from weight distribution to metabolism makes that a pretty sweeping generalization. I gained most of my weight at college, I lived with 3 'naturally skinny' friends. We ate together, we did everything together. I gained 60 lbs, they stayed slim. I would therefore define them as more 'naturally skinny' than I am.

somehow i doubt that you and your roommates moved in perfect unison and consumed identical meals for four years.

Speaking of optimum state, I reject your darwinistic 'skinny people win' perception. People prone to obesity many times have a slower metabolism (or as I like to call it, a very 'efficient body'). They get more out of what they eat. From an evolutionary standpoint this would make them less susceptible to problems with food shortage and make them more likely to survive famine, thus making them the darwinistic optimum.

i'll buy that people who carry an extra 20 or 30 pounds might have an evolutionary advantage.  that--again--is why i specifically spoke of clinical obesity as being maladaptive.

As for your list, yeah, some of it was rude. If my landlord gave me flowers, unless I was deathly allergic, I would thank her and dispose of the flowers after she left. I'm not complaining about these people because they're skinny, but because they are rude and its the only rudeness I'm dealing with on a regular basis atm. I'm not referring to the naturally skinny has having any retardation or any problem other than not always being aware of how a comment might come off to an overweight person.

i didn't purposely tell my landlady that i was allergic to the flowers she gave me.  i'm not good with flowers, they were wrapped, and i didn't know what they were.  we went outside, she commented on the peonies in the garden, and that's when i made my comment.  it was only after she left that i realized she'd given me peonies.  i'm not rude; i'm just horticulturally ignorant.  but i probably sounded rude.

my point was that it's like that don't-think-of-an-elephant thing; when we're telling ourselves not to talk about weight, because we don't want to offend someone, sometimes that's what comes out of our mouths.  we are human.

And the genetic predisposition of obesity, shown even in adoption studies so that environment isn't a factor, is pretty well established.

see above post re: predisposition.  i have predispositions to cancer and heart disease.  i'm doing everything i can to avoid them (so far, so good).

Oh, and it's a forum, its a great place for opinions. Actually, its a motivation forum, so its a great place to express a rant that other people in a situation similar to mine deal with and also want to get off their chest. They did. They might still be if they weren't so concerned you would bite their head off for daring to not hate themselves at their horrible 'unnatural' condition.

um...it wasn't yourself you were expressing hate toward.  it was the "naturally skinny."  naturally skinny people need motivation and support, too.  try not targetting a specific group of people in your next motivational post.

I don't mind intellectual dissent, but it sounds like you have absolutely no idea where I was coming from or trying to say.

If you still think I was skinny bashing, start over and try again.

i know what you're trying to say.  i'm just trying to present the other side.  i was a "naturally skinny" person - until i got fat.  i've been on both sides of this.  i've suffered from foot-in-mouth syndrome, and i've listened to people 50 pounds lighter than me talk about how fat they are.  i understand that the vast majority of the time, people are not trying to be hurtful. 

if i get offended, that's mine to own.  nobody else did that to me.

If I am offended by something someone says to me, often it's because they were being offensive, and I might bitch about it later rather than confront the meanie. And I'd hope I'd get some sympathy or agreement instead if just "Hey own it, it's your own problem". And I would hope that saying I wished people could be more sensitive and kind to me (and everyone, really) would not be something to argue about.

I am not too sure what's being meant by obesity being "unnatural". Makes me feel like the undead or something (I imagine a crowd gathering around me, pointing and whispering "oooohhh that's just not natural!!" Human bodies are so incredibly complex, denying that there could be a "fat" gene is what's laughable, though that's simplifying it a lot....there are hormones and peptides and enzymes and neurotransmitters and things I don't even know about or can imagine all interacting with environmental input and to think that everyone's body handles food the exact same way is pretty primitive. And by body, I also include how our brain processes as well, what may be a simple want in some people may be more of a need in others, how can you judge how someone sees blue? Can obesity be an inevitability for some people? I don't know. Is it an inevitability for me? No, I don't think so, I am turning the tide, I am lucky to have figured out how to do that. But I don't feel like I was ever, or AM, "unnatural". And like the OP says, I won't apologize for not hating myself for being obese - in fact learning to love and respect myself despite how society made me feel was my biggest challenge and really what enabled me to start taking better care of myself and losing weight. Eeks got a little smarmy there.

I also think there's a huge difference between someone inadvertantly putting thier foot in ther mouth (like the peonies example) and someone who is deliberately being rude because they don't feel you deserve any respect. If a size 4 girl asked ME if I thought they looked fat...well I'd probably want to rant about how rude that was too.

if your rant was about rude people, it shouldnt have been titled ''rant at the naturally skinny''

if you Had put rude, you wouldnt come across as bitter to anyone.

just do whats best for you, dont let rudeness get you down. x and really a lot of people play down another persons weight issues because it makes for an awkward conversation. its called having tact. that is different to rudeness which is exhibited by as many normal and obese people than skinny.

good luck on your goal!x

Semantics. Blah. Has this has turned into the forum where skinny people get to lecture fat people instead of the motivation forum where we support each other in our goals and try to show some empathy? If you took this as an attack on the entire population of skinny people, maybe you should try reading it again. Then read it again. Then go to the maintenance forum and bitch about whiny fat people if that's still where you're mentality takes you.

So being fat is my lifestyle choice? Sure, ok, good. Thanks for helping me see the error of my fat ways. Maybe now I should go find a weightloss site to help me deal with that in a healthy way... Oh Wait! That's what I thought this was!

Thanks victoriagirl. Again, I'm glad to hear there are other people that understand and have experienced what I'm saying and don't view it as mean, judgemental, or 'insecure' : )

I may start a differnt post on the etiology of obesity, since there is some debate, though I def. agree with you (and I'd need to do some research first).

ktjo: I have already stated that I fully agree that obese, normal weight people, and underweight people exhibit the same rates of rudeness and likelihood for doing so. The rant is at skinny people because right now the only rudeness I'm getting regularly is about weight, and is coming from skinny people. Its a problem of situation, not anything about the population as whole. Good luck to you to!

Original Post by minda_spk:

ktjo: I have already stated that I fully agree that obese, normal weight people, and underweight people exhibit the same rates of rudeness and likelihood for doing so. The rant is at skinny people because right now the only rudeness I'm getting regularly is about weight, and is coming from skinny people. Its a problem of situation, not anything about the population as whole. Good luck to you to!

I don't think that anyone is trying to be "rude" to you. I really feel that you are taking offense to it because of your own insecurities on weight/food issues. Be big or small, you will always have people in general making rude comments. We're arrogant human beings. But in the end, they are only trying to help by passing on what they see as helpful advice.

Even after losing 175 pounds I would think people would quit with the rude comments, but they never stop. It's always something. "I can't believe you just ate all that!" "Oh you can have cake too?" "Aw what happened to your butt!"

*rolls eyes*

Original Post by sadinplaid:

Semantics. Blah. Has this has turned into the forum where skinny people get to lecture fat people instead of the motivation forum where we support each other in our goals and try to show some empathy? If you took this as an attack on the entire population of skinny people, maybe you should try reading it again. Then read it again. Then go to the maintenance forum and bitch about whiny fat people if that's still where you're mentality takes you.

So being fat is my lifestyle choice? Sure, ok, good. Thanks for helping me see the error of my fat ways. Maybe now I should go find a weightloss site to help me deal with that in a healthy way... Oh Wait! That's what I thought this was!

This post is so funny to me (in a good way).   I love how some skinny people come on a weight loss forum and then complain that they are prejudiced against.  Im pretty sure the OP meant for this thread to be much more lighthearted than some people took it.  

Also if you want to talk to some awesome, super fit/healthy people, the fitness forum is the best place to find them.  That forum is so inspirational and encouraging.

Original Post by minda_spk:

The rant is at skinny people because right now the only rudeness I'm getting regularly is about weight, and is coming from skinny people. Its a problem of situation, not anything about the population as whole. Good luck to you to!

think you might be particularly attuned to that kind of rudeness?

i've almost been run over three times this week by people who don't want to stop their cars on the hill in my neighbourhood - in spite of the fact that there are stop signs and cross walks.  i find that pretty rude, and now every time i approach those intersections, i'm looking for someone to almost run me over.  in other words, i expect it, i'm looking for it, hence, i see it (truth be told, i almost invite it).

if people are running stops signs that doesnt have anything to do with your thoughts beforehand.  i do get what your saying, that we have a choice in how we perceive things, but other people also have a choice over their actions too. 

Original Post by sadinplaid:

Semantics. Blah. Has this has turned into the forum where skinny people get to lecture fat people instead of the motivation forum where we support each other in our goals and try to show some empathy? If you took this as an attack on the entire population of skinny people, maybe you should try reading it again. Then read it again. Then go to the maintenance forum and bitch about whiny fat people if that's still where you're mentality takes you.

So being fat is my lifestyle choice? Sure, ok, good. Thanks for helping me see the error of my fat ways. Maybe now I should go find a weightloss site to help me deal with that in a healthy way... Oh Wait! That's what I thought this was!

My comments were directed at the OP, who claimed that slow metabolisms and a genetic predisposition to obesity are in many cases responsible for obesity. I notice you don't have any problem with her making those claims, yet you have a big problem with me claiming the opposite. Wasn't the op lecturing too then? Bias much?

CalorieCount is not a weight loss site per se. It's a calorie counting site. I can count calories and not lose weight. I could count calories and be gaining weight, like plenty of CC members are trying to do. If you think that only overweight people should be allowed to use all the forums, you're the one being rude.