Raw foodists

Do we have any on here? Or is anyone familiar with them?

One of my friends (an ex actually) is a vegan and is trying to head down that path, but I can't help but think its incredibly unhealthy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm totally pro-raw foods . . . its just the prospect of eating ONLY raw foods . . .

For starters- carbs? You need them to live, yet there aren't many carb sources you can eat raw. Oats? Apparently there's a way of "cooking" rice that just involves soaking it in water.

I dunno. I suppose I'm concerned for my friend. She's already really thin and doesn't eat enough (while we were dating I tried to calculate how much she eats in a day and it was rarely over 1000-1200). Can people actually live like this? And should they?

Thoughts? Ideas? Opinions?

Something about cooking breaks down most of the nutrients in food that are more readily available when raw.  I could never do but I do know a few people who do.    I can barely choke down a raw chunk of broccoli (without coating it in ranch, lol) but steamed broccoli is one of my absolute favorite foods... mmm, mmm good!

I have heard they can actually warm the food up - as long as it doesn't get hot enough to actually cook it... I don't know if that would be sufficient to cook rice or pasta  though?? 

Don't worry about your friend... if she does it right she'll be more than okay.

I've investigated going raw and currently maybe 60% to 75% of my diet is raw.

Eating raw is actually very healthy, and believe me carbs are not a problem.  Fruit and vegetable calories come almost exclusively from carbs.

I eat several servings of raw fruit for breakfast and again for a couple of snacks throughout the day.  I eat a large salad for lunch daily.  Except for the salad dressing, this is all raw food.

I do almost always eat a cooked dinner each evening but if I chose to eat raw food I'm sure that I'd be fine.

I've been eating this way for about a year and a half now and have no health problems and am able to maintain a normal weight.

All fruit is usually eaten raw.  Most vegetables can be eaten raw (but a raw turnip or potato just grosses me out).

Pretty well all grains can be "cooked" by soaking them in cold water instead of boiling them in hot.  It just takes longer.  They can also be ground to a powder and then mixed into a paste with some water and herbs, or fresh squeezed juice.

Cooking food does destroy a large portion of the nutrients. The only exception I know of are carrots and sweet potatoes, since cooking will release more of the beta caroteen (althopugh it also destroys most of the other vitamins, including vit A).

vit C is easily destroyed by even small temperature changes, or even by light (which is the reason I guess, why there are no clear or see-through fruit).

It's not just cooking that destroys vitamins though.  Any type of processing does that.  Drying fruit will destroy vitamins.  Check the nutritional information on raisend and compare it to grapes.

I've been eating raw for over 6 months, never felt better..


:D

Your friend has an ED....   Veganism often obscures EDs because, by definition, it's an extreme way of eating.   A responsible person would 'do it properly' and make sure they were getting a good range of foods and the right energy intake to stay fit and well.   Whereas 1000 - 1200 cals a day is starvation, you're right.  And it doesn't matter whether she's a starving carnivore or a starving vegan...  it's still starvation.   And no it's not healthy in the slightest.

Going the raw food route she's just extending the obsession and she's likely to treat it as an opportunity to eat even less but claim that it's a 'legitimate' lifestyle choice.  Talk her into going to see a doctor instead. 

Original Post by gi-jane:

Your friend has an ED.... Veganism often obscures EDs because, by definition, it's an extreme way of eating. A responsible person would 'do it properly' and make sure they were getting a good range of foods and the right energy intake to stay fit and well. Whereas 1000 - 1200 cals a day is starvation, you're right. And it doesn't matter whether she's a starving carnivore or a starving vegan... it's still starvation. And no it's not healthy in the slightest.

Going the raw food route she's just extending the obsession and she's likely to treat it as an opportunity to eat even less but claim that it's a 'legitimate' lifestyle choice. Talk her into going to see a doctor instead.

sorry, i have to disagree with this completely. raw foodists and vegans do NOT all have ed's. sure, they're picky, but that doesn't equal disordered. it is incredibly easy to get more than 1200 on a raw food diet.

there's a raw food restaurant in NYC and they consider food as raw if it's never been above (I think) 118 degrees because above that something happens with the enzymes in the plants.

But heating to that degree allows for more 'cooking' of food than the word raw implies.

Original Post by ewwxroflzz:

Original Post by gi-jane:

Your friend has an ED.... Veganism often obscures EDs because, by definition, it's an extreme way of eating. A responsible person would 'do it properly' and make sure they were getting a good range of foods and the right energy intake to stay fit and well. Whereas 1000 - 1200 cals a day is starvation, you're right. And it doesn't matter whether she's a starving carnivore or a starving vegan... it's still starvation. And no it's not healthy in the slightest.

Going the raw food route she's just extending the obsession and she's likely to treat it as an opportunity to eat even less but claim that it's a 'legitimate' lifestyle choice. Talk her into going to see a doctor instead.

sorry, i have to disagree with this completely. raw foodists and vegans do NOT all have ed's. sure, they're picky, but that doesn't equal disordered. it is incredibly easy to get more than 1200 on a raw food diet.

I'm not sure if you read the whole thing. She didn't say that all raw-foodists and vegans have an ED. Actually, she said quite the opposite. She just pointed out that it's easier to hide an ED if you're eating an "extreme" diet because of the potential for pickiness. She fully acknowledged that there are carnivores with EDs, and that a raw-foodist who "does it right" isn't a starving one.

''there's a raw food restaurant in NYC and they consider food as raw if it's never been above (I think) 118 degrees because above that something happens with the enzymes in the plants.''

this is true! most susbstantial meals in a raw diet have been 'dehydrated' for a number of hours.  i think this prevents enzyme breakdown.

i always go to a vegan restaurant in santa cruz and half the food is raw, and i LOVE it! there's raw everything... pizzas, pies etc.  the raw diet isnt just fruit and veg as people may assume, but can be really varied.  the downside is that it requires a lot of planning - most recipes take a loong time to make, are fairly complicated and require specialized ingredients. its not a diet for the faint of heart!

a great website to look at is fromsadtoraw.com

I'm not trying to be rude, but I am curious about the supposed health benefits of the raw food diet.  The main argument to go raw that I have seen is that cooking food breaks down/destroys nutrients.  Yes, cooking food can break down nutrients, proteins are denatured, which means they break down, (they're made up of amino acids, and then stuck together in complicated ways) when cooked.  However, this isn't destroying them, our body would break them down anyway.  Our bodies can't handle the whole proteins/other nutrient molecules, we break them down into simple sugars and amino acids and things and then the human body uses these ingredients to reconstruct the things it needs.

I'm not saying that it is necessarily BAD to eat raw, but can anybody site a peer-reviewed scientific paper which says that our bodied don't actually break down nutrients and then reassemble them in new ways?

Thanks!
Trid

Protein isn't the only nutrient people need to worry about.  Many micronutrients are broken down and lost during cooking.

That said, I'm not a raw foodist.  My aim is to eat 50/50 raw to cooked veggies.  It's important to get raw veggies in your diet, but I think it's unrealistic to try to get most or all raw food in your diet.  It'd just be too difficult to eat all that bulk and I personally wouldn't be able to handle things like potatoes, beans, and kale raw.

Sorry, I don't have any studies handy about this though.  I may be able to dig some up.

What micronutrients?

Some examples of heat sensitive micronutrients are vitamins A, C, D, and thiamin.

i had a roommate briefly last summer who was a raw foodist.  she would get up in the middle of the night and binge on my cooked food (mostly fish and meat).  yeah, that was fun.  she thought she was "recovered" from disordered eating.  she wasn't.  she also ran compulsively, kept her body covered neck-to-toe on the hottest summer days, and lived in filth (though she kept it to her part of the house).  so, the only raw foodist i know is one sick puppy.

Raw food diets are just another fad that will fizzle out eventually.  They're probably OK for someone living in a warm climate but as I sit here wrapped in a fleece having just come back home through snow and ice I can't imagine tucking into a nice cold plate of anything!   Raw food has its place but surely it's a fairly basic human pleasure to have something warm and comforting nestling in your stomach?

Yes, we do lose a lot of nutrients when we cook food but if it's a balanced diet we still get more than enough in total. 

Raw food is a way of living, like vegetarianism, not a fad diet. I'm transitioning to what I hope will be a 75%-85% raw intake and I must say, it feels healthier and better than cooked. I'm someone who ends up eating half the vegetables for the meal before they get cooked anyways, so eating more raw is not difficult at all.

Carbs are easy to get through fruits and sprouted grains such as Quinoa- most rices have been processed so they are not raw. Wild rice is not a rice. Protein is not an issue, the best argument I've ever seen was a photo of a 300lb of muscle male gorilla asking does he look like he is lacking protein? Either way, Quinoa has protein as do lentils and other legumes that can be sprouted- you can also eat nuts and seeds.

Main thing to get enough of is oil. Avocados, nuts and seeds once again. You won't lack calories if you have enough of these. If you also learn to make raw desserts you may even have too many calories in your diet. Many are more calorific than non raw as they may be coconut oil based.

In all, Raw food is a lifestyle that is really intended for those who believe most in it, and enjoy raw foods. The majority of raw foodists that I've met are very down to earth, all natural product buying, energetic, and worldly minded individuals concerned more about health than about weight loss. That is the way that it should be when transitioning to such an extreme lifestyle- you really have to believe in it.

Original Post by sandra_jean:

Original Post by ewwxroflzz:

Original Post by gi-jane:

Your friend has an ED.... Veganism often obscures EDs because, by definition, it's an extreme way of eating. A responsible person would 'do it properly' and make sure they were getting a good range of foods and the right energy intake to stay fit and well. Whereas 1000 - 1200 cals a day is starvation, you're right. And it doesn't matter whether she's a starving carnivore or a starving vegan... it's still starvation. And no it's not healthy in the slightest.

Going the raw food route she's just extending the obsession and she's likely to treat it as an opportunity to eat even less but claim that it's a 'legitimate' lifestyle choice. Talk her into going to see a doctor instead.

sorry, i have to disagree with this completely. raw foodists and vegans do NOT all have ed's. sure, they're picky, but that doesn't equal disordered. it is incredibly easy to get more than 1200 on a raw food diet.

I'm not sure if you read the whole thing. She didn't say that all raw-foodists and vegans have an ED. Actually, she said quite the opposite. She just pointed out that it's easier to hide an ED if you're eating an "extreme" diet because of the potential for pickiness. She fully acknowledged that there are carnivores with EDs, and that a raw-foodist who "does it right" isn't a starving one.

 "Your friend has an ED.... Veganism often obscures EDs because, by definition, it's an extreme way of eating. "

 

I think the fact that she accuses politica's ex of having an ED threw me off and negated your entire argument. That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

1. An eating disorder is a PSYCHOLOGICAL problem, not an actual "eating" problem.

2. BECAUSE of this, it's none of anyone's buisness whether she had an eating disorder or not. It's not applicable to this discussion- period. You just want to know so that you can judge the reasoning behind her decision and whether it was healthy or not, but gaw... how about thinking for yourself!

Well, I first became vegan because I was anorexic and I thought it would be a great excuse to get out of eating fast food and birthday cake. I know some other girls who have done the same thing.

And I actually tried eating raw (again to lose weight) but I couldnt last. I love my cooked veggies! Not all vegetables lose nutrients in cooking, for example its easier for your body to access the lycopene in tomatoes if they are cooked.

If someone is  eating under 1200 cals a day, the do not necessarily have an eating disorder. They may be stressed, it may be a rare thing, or you may have miscalculated their calorie intake or not seen them eat some things. If they continue to eat under 1200 and do it *intentionallly*, then they have disordered eating. The diagnosis of having an eating disorder is up to a doctor, not people on weight-loss forums :)

haricot, you're right that EDs are psychological and not about food and eating, but they're diagnosed by behaviour, not by a brain biopsy.  i think that diagnoses are thrown around way too liberally here, but it's not unreasonable to suggest that someone with pathological eating patterns has an eating disorder.