spirochete to cyclists: I HATE YOU. I hate you so much and I hate your next 15 generations

I hope your bikes melt down and your little helmets crack and and you lose a bike seat up your butt.

Do you ride on the bike path RIGHT NEXT TO THE STREET? HELL NO! You ride right in the street and hold up traffic.

Do you ride single file as traffic goes by? HELL NO! You ride in pairs while blocking traffic and we're all at your mercy driving at bicycle speed for miles on end.

Do you ride in a responsible manner? HELL NO! You cry that you have just as much right to the street as I do in my car yet you run EVERY SINGLE stop sign, turn without signaling and whatever illegal maneuvers you can think up while wearing a Doritos branded spandex team shirt.

I seriously hate cyclists so much.

When I am in my car I also hate cyclists, and when I am on my bike i truly hate cars. And buses. And big ole trucks with rear view mirrors that stick out 3 feet from the side of the truck and the driver decides to pass me in a narrow lane and nearly konks me right in the head.

I bike to work and there is a bike lane about half of the way. When I am on the regular road, i stay close to the curb and am very careful about swinging further out to avoid glass, parked cars, or other obstacles. I ALWAYS stop at red lights and stop signs and follow the rules of the road. I am extremely aware that I am totally vulnerable, and that i might have the right of way but being right will do me no good if I am dead or in traction.

I wish that there was a bike lane the whole way...but the truth is, the bike lane is not that much safer. I am rewarded for my consideration to cars and traffic by having them block the bike lane to make right turns and just sit there while pedestrians are crossing, trucks and buses travelling half-way in the bike lane, and all sorts of other unnecessary and inconsiderate and dangerous behaviour. Dangerous to me, that is. They are surrounded by 2000 lbs of metal. I am not.

I realize I am the minority, I know darn well how hazardous it is to drive around obnoxious cyclists. I guess it just boils down to, people can be obnoxious in both cars and on bikes, period. Thanks for the place to vent! 

I am not going to get into all what I "believe," but what are the actual rules? I mean, I heard someone say that bikers are not allowed on side walks. Is that true? And are they really SUPPOSED to ride in the middle of the road?!

Original Post by psychoj:

I am not going to get into all what I "believe," but what are the actual rules? I mean, I heard someone say that bikers are not allowed on side walks. Is that true? And are they really SUPPOSED to ride in the middle of the road?!

 I think the couple serious cyclists may have abandoned this thread, but as far as I know in IL cyclists are NOT legally allowed to ride on the sidewalk. I do not think it's illegal for them to ride in the middle of the road, but from what I could gather they are strongly encouraged not to.

What is amazing to me is that people seem not to be like victoriagirl and others in this thread in my area. I don't know why, but like I said there is a HUGE cycling for sport community in my area. I guess they feel some safety in numbers thing because the last thing that seems to be on their mind is their own safety.

Putting aside what is annoying to me, spirochete, rule of the universe, what I see them do looks really dangerous to them. I had posted this morning a little diagram of some woman that cut over four lanes of traffic while running a red light and causing oncoming traffic to slam on their brakes. There is nothing I can think of that would cause me to risk my life like that and I see it all the time around here. When I say all the time, I mean like once a day. This isn't a once in a while thing

and if they do cause an accident, they're going to ruin someone else's life also, like stated before the person driving the car is going to be the one in trouble. Not to mention the trauma of hitting someone (especially when not your fault).

That woman must have a death wish spirochete. I'm surprised by the 'balls' some of these people have in these stories, do they think they're invincible?

I bike commute 2 - 3 times a week and cars scare the hell out of me.  I have a 4.5 mile commute and often see 3 - 6 other cyclists on the road.  The roads I take have no bike lines but I do ride on the shoulder as do the other cyclists I see on the road.

I've never seen a cyclist run a red light and it is something I would never consider doing.  And yes, I have even stopped at a red light when there was no traffic coming from any direction.

I will admit, I often only yield at stop signs but, at minimum, I always yield.  If it is a 2 way stop and someone is coming, I stop.  If it is a 4 way and I know I can get through before a car coming up to the 4 way stops, then a go for it.  This should in no way inconvenience the other car, unless he/she wasn't planning on stopping at the stop sign.  Let the record show, I have stopped at a 4 way stop.

When I ride my bike my main goals (in order of importance) are my own safety and not pissing off arrogant drivers around me (not all drivers are arrogant but it is the arrogant ones that tend to get pissed off at cyclists even when cyclists are following all traffic rules).

Someone said that they have never seen a cop give a cyclist a ticket because cops don't care about cyclists.  I would say this is part of the problem.  No one, not even cops, cares about cyclists; until one is hit.  It makes riding my bike a lot more frightening.

In an attempt to propagate mutual understanding between drivers and cyclists, here are a few of my main concerns (in no particular order) while I'm on my bike:
1.  Drivers simply not seeing me; drivers that don't pay attention to what is going on around them.  Note:  this is also a concern of mine when I am in a car, even though I drive an SUV.
2.  Debris.  The more I ride my bike the more I see debris scattered all along the shoulder (it isn't in the main lanes which may be why some cyclists choose to ride in the lane instead of the shoulder).  I do my best to avoid debris but still punctured a tire on Monday.
3.  Cars on the shoulder.  This includes
     *parked cars,
     *cars that are parking,
     *cars that think they can pull out (sometimes right at me or right in front of me) onto the shoulder at an intersection or drive way,
     *cars that think they can drive on the shoulder (when it is illegal),
     *cars that intentionally swerve toward me (it is my firm belief that any driver that intentionally swerves toward a cyclist, no matter what their intention, should be flogged, charged with assault with a deadly weapon, and have their license permanantly revoked),
     *cars that are next to me and want to get onto the shoulder to make a right turn (For example, the other day I was coming up to a red light where the shoulder turns into the right turn lane.  I stay in the shoulder/turn lane but to the left so that drivers wanting to turn right can do so.  A truck, and not a small truck, that wanted to turn right nearly hit me as he was getting into the turn lane (I did nothing wrong) then proceeded to honk at me like it was my fault he didn't see me).

Yes, spirochete, some cyclists do stupid things but some drivers do stupid things to; neither is right or ok and neither justifies the other.  In fact, while driving, my life and the lives of other people on the road have been put in more danger by other drivers than have been by cyclists.  While driving I rarely encounter a cyclist that is being dangerous or stupid.  Maybe you are just living in the wrong town.

Meh I don't really mind cyclists, in Greece at least there are hardly any. BUT I hate the motorcyclists. They do exactly what spirochete mentioned in her original post. In Greece you can never have a great car ride without:

1. Being cut off while waiting at a traffic light - yes people come and line up IN FRONT of the first person in the line.

2. Having at least 3 motorcycles swerving in front of you and to the side - never having heard of a queue.

I think we should ban motorcycles ;p

Better yet, ban all motor transport and just get people to ride bikes all day, or walk. The environment would be so much better off.

Original Post by spirochete:

Original Post by psychoj:

I am not going to get into all what I "believe," but what are the actual rules? I mean, I heard someone say that bikers are not allowed on side walks. Is that true? And are they really SUPPOSED to ride in the middle of the road?!

 I think the couple serious cyclists may have abandoned this thread, but as far as I know in IL cyclists are NOT legally allowed to ride on the sidewalk. I do not think it's illegal for them to ride in the middle of the road, but from what I could gather they are strongly encouraged not to.

 

 I won't be bullied so I am still here.

Here is the IL rule book for cyclist.

http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/publication s/pdf_publications/dsd_a1434.pdf

I guess the point of showing her PM is to make her look bad (ooo swearing), but I think it shows she's quite caring...

Original Post by psychoj:

I am not going to get into all what I "believe," but what are the actual rules? I mean, I heard someone say that bikers are not allowed on side walks. Is that true? And are they really SUPPOSED to ride in the middle of the road?!

As for California, they aren't supposed to be in the middle of the road (with certain exceptions):

• C.V.C. 21202 (a): Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway....

It makes exceptions for turning left and trying to get around parked obstructions, but they are supposed to stay as far right as then possibly can.

California has no law against riding on the sidewalk, but Los Angeles does:

• L.A.M.C. 56.15: No person shall ride, operate or use a bicycle, unicycle, skateboard, cart, wagon, wheelchair, rollerskates, or any other device moved exclusively by human power, on a sidewalk, bikeway or boardwalk in a willful or wanton disregard for the safety of persons or property.

I suppose if I did some research I could figure out what the court is considering "willful or wanton disregard" for safety, but I'll assume that cruising out into the street at full speed at a cross-walk would be close.

[Damn my meetings, we went from 143 when I started to 150 by the time I finally hit post]

Original Post by spirochete:

Original Post by oit:

Spiro, it sure seems there is that one group that bugs the crap outta you, but please do try to consider that most of us, even if we do wear spandex (although never could bring myself to wear it sans-jocks, and the pic of the polish team reinforces my habit!), try to be considerate, and hope to be treated likewise.

 It's more than one group; it's the cycling community as a whole where I live. While I can understand the confusion, no where was it EVER stated I didn't drive around cyclists with their safety in mind.

In fact, most of what irks me is I go out of my way to make sure I do not come anywhere near them, startle them with my car or do anything that would remotely endanger them. As I'm doing that, they are driving around doing one stupid thing after the next.

 As a cyclist, I felt the need to defend against your attitude, but also, I stand corrected, happy to see your behaviour is much different than your attitude towards cyclists.

I basically agree with pretty much all of what atech said.

As a cyclist that rides on the road all the time, and always in a defensive manner (i.e. almost ALWAYS assuming that I am virutally invisible to cars, and therefore trying to be prepared for anything), I would probably also be horrified and angry at cyclists behaving in a manner which not only puts there own lives at risk, but also unneccesarily inconveniences the drivers on the road.

I mentioned before that I never use bicycle paths, but I think I also need to explain what a bicycle path is here in Japan.  From an earlier post above, it seems a bicycle path may be "part of the road" rather than "part of the footpath", i.e. the road is wider and there is a line marking the bike section?  In Tokyo, the bike path is part of the footpath, which just means the footpath is a wide one with a line roughly down the middle marking one side for pedestrians and one side for cyclists.  Never works, people always walk on the whole of the path.

In terms of the laws of the road relating to stop signs and red lights, there are actually benefits to drivers of cyclists treating all intersections like "give-way" signs.  Providing cyclists always check to make sure there is no cross traffic, it can be better for cars if cyclists get going before the rest of the traffic to clear the intersection for drivers wanting to turn.  Drivers should also feel more comfortable passing a bike that is already in a relatively predictable straight motion than one that is rather slow getting started, and not so predictable as to what they are doing.  What is worse for you (just a generic "you", not aimed at anyone specific), your annoyance at seeing a cyclist go through a red light (safely), or actually being inconvenienced by having to wait for a cyclist to get out of your way?

I am not the most law-abiding cyclist about, but I am pretty sure I am one of the most responsible, safety-conscious, motorist friendly one.  I guess I am also annoyed by those that act in ways that give cyclists a bad rap.

Wow, Spiro.  Always love your posts and your brilliant commentary!  I'm with you on this one. 

My 2 pennies?  Live in downtown Houston and deal with the pizza delivery cyclists then you will know real rage.

I ride my bike in Kansas and there are no laws against riding bikes on sidewalks because our only options are sidewalks and roads.  The law here says that we are to be treated as drivers on the road and pedestrians on the sidewalk.  I ride on the sidewalk only when the road next to me is too busy for people to pass me (rush hour) or so slow that if I came to a stop light, it wouldn't change because I would be the only one there (5:30 am).

Bicyclists SHOULD NOT ride far enough into the gutter so motorists can have their whole precious right lane.  Not only would a cyclist get so many flat tires due to all the broken glass and stuff in the gutter, but it decreases visibility.  It is much safer for a motorist to react to a bike with "Ugh... a bicyclist..." than the surprise of "...ACK!  A bicyclist!"  We only want to be SEEN so we don't get run over.  Riding on the sidewalk also decreases visibility, but sometimes we need that option.

gmule,

you have a PM

Make it his avatar

Original Post by atech:

I bike commute 2 - 3 times a week and cars scare the hell out of me.  I have a 4.5 mile commute and often see 3 - 6 other cyclists on the road.  The roads I take have no bike lines but I do ride on the shoulder as do the other cyclists I see on the road.

I've never seen a cyclist run a red light and it is something I would never consider doing.  And yes, I have even stopped at a red light when there was no traffic coming from any direction.  You have?... just once?... or was it twice? OMG, would you like a cookie?

I will admit, I often only yield at stop signs but, at minimum, I always yield.  Illegal.  If it is a 2 way stop and someone is coming, I stop.  If it is a 4 way and I know I can get through before a car coming up to the 4 way stops, then a go for it.  Illegal.  This should in no way inconvenience the other car, unless he/she wasn't planning on stopping at the stop sign.  There are lots of crimes that might not "inconvenience" other people, but they're still illegal.  Let the record show, I have stopped at a 4 way stop.  Chocolate chip or almonds on that cookie?

When I ride my bike my main goals (in order of importance) are my own safety and not pissing off arrogant drivers around me (not all drivers are arrogant but it is the arrogant ones that tend to get pissed off at cyclists even when cyclists are following all traffic rules).  I wonder what would happen if we all considered ourselves first and the rules of the road were an afterthought.

In an attempt to propagate mutual understanding between drivers and cyclists, here are a few of my main concerns (in no particular order) while I'm on my bike:
1.  Drivers simply not seeing me; I guess we now know why they wear that ugly spandex.
2.  Debris.
3.  Cars on the shoulder.  

Original Post by dcyounts:

Original Post by atech:

I will admit, I often only yield at stop signs but, at minimum, I always yield. Illegal. If it is a 2 way stop and someone is coming, I stop. If it is a 4 way and I know I can get through before a car coming up to the 4 way stops, then a go for it. Illegal. This should in no way inconvenience the other car, unless he/she wasn't planning on stopping at the stop sign. There are lots of crimes that might not "inconvenience" other people, but they're still illegal. Let the record show, I have stopped at a 4 way stop. Chocolate chip or almonds on that cookie?

I just want to know what makes cyclists think that they have special rules just for them when it comes to stop signs?  I run them.  I yield at them.  I stop at them... sometimes.

(I wonder about the other laws they break also, but not at the moment of this post.)

I have calmed down considerably since my first post, but that can change so look out. Anyway, here are my thoughts on this I sometimes stop at signs and lights: what a bad habit to get into! Yeah, it's illegal and if I did it in my car I'd have a HUGE ticket. That's besides the point.

The point is, the more you do something the more it becomes second nature. You blow through them when there are NO cars around, then you blow through them when a car is far enough away and before you know it, you're the pack of 40 no good jerks in my neighborhood not even glancing when going through signs like cars aren't even there.

I know I'm not presenting any facts here, but just my thoughts. It seems like a dangerous habit to start.

Original Post by theshockwave:

I just want to know what makes cyclists think that they have special rules just for them when it comes to stop signs? 

 Probably the same thing that makes motorists think they have special rules just for them when it comes to speed limits.