Stage 5

I've finished Stage 4 and am now entering Stage 5 - which is clearly Stage 3 all over again with less reps.  Has anyone done Stage 5 with only 2 sets?  I remember the Stage 3 workouts getting crazy long and me losing motivation to do them because of that.  When I look at the exercises, I don't remember having issues with anything in particular - just the length.

Strangely enough, I'm looking forward to doing the body weight matrix again - even if it does completely wipe me out.

WOW - 4 pounds is alot in that short of time.  Did you really watch your diet?  I have a hard time with "fat loss" workouts and getting really really hungry after.  You did great! 

It is so weird, but I always seem to gain a couple pounds for summer.  I am not sure if it is because my body is not having to keep warm or extra water holding or if I am just eating more because I become more active!   I would much rather have the extra couple in the winter.

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

WOW - 4 pounds is alot in that short of time.  Did you really watch your diet?  I have a hard time with "fat loss" workouts and getting really really hungry after.  You did great! 

It is so weird, but I always seem to gain a couple pounds for summer.  I am not sure if it is because my body is not having to keep warm or extra water holding or if I am just eating more because I become more active!   I would much rather have the extra couple in the winter.

 yeah my fat cells don't listen to me either.

actually in oct 08 i did rffl, the first couple of weeks i think it shocks your body but then it gets used to it. i lost steadily for another couple of weeks, but by week 5 my body was just to used to it. i had to add in some jump roping in between instead of rest periods. so i do think 4 weeks of any routine is enough for my body.

Original Post by octo-luv:

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

Octo - so did you lose any weight/fat doing rffl?

but since my little back/chest pain i started to stuff myself with food again, ugh. was very bad. i kind of lost my way but im refocusing again. i might do it again after i finish new rules, but i can't wait to start stage 6.

 Something similar happened to me.  I dieted down in April and was really happy with the way I was looking.  In May I was planning on maintaining and just started stuffing my face.  I am now back where I started.  What do you think causes that?  Do you think the set point theory has some merit and our bodies fight back if we get leaner than it thinks we should be?  Is is psychological?  I don't know, but I did the same thing you did.  And it sucks because I worked so hard in April just to see it go out the window in May.  I can't really complain -  I am not overweight and I look fine.  But I am shooting for a super lean, ripped look and I think my body doesn't want to go there - or my head - not sure which. 

Original Post by laura42:

Original Post by octo-luv:

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

Octo - so did you lose any weight/fat doing rffl?

but since my little back/chest pain i started to stuff myself with food again, ugh. was very bad. i kind of lost my way but im refocusing again. i might do it again after i finish new rules, but i can't wait to start stage 6.

 Something similar happened to me.  I dieted down in April and was really happy with the way I was looking.  In May I was planning on maintaining and just started stuffing my face.  I am now back where I started.  What do you think causes that?  Do you think the set point theory has some merit and our bodies fight back if we get leaner than it thinks we should be?  Is is psychological?  I don't know, but I did the same thing you did.  And it sucks because I worked so hard in April just to see it go out the window in May.  I can't really complain -  I am not overweight and I look fine.  But I am shooting for a super lean, ripped look and I think my body doesn't want to go there - or my head - not sure which. 

im can totally sympathize with you on that one. not only have i sabotaged myself a few times, i remember times when i would gain some muscle only to stupidly starve it away. oh well live and learn.

i do think that there might be some truth to the set point. altho i came to the realization yesterday on why i some times sabotage myself. i have what i call my inner brat. some times i try to surpress it but other times it just comes with no warning, or so subtley that i don't notice it.  well yesterday i decided that im going to listen to and learn from my inner brat. i think it only surfaces if i don't have enough balance in my life. i don't know, but im experiementing.

last nights workout B was just ok. had to go down in weight, only did 3 sets before i was kicked out of the gym. got enough time to do 4 minutes of tabata intervals on the bike. i was starting to jump rope as a warm up but all the ropes are now broken at my lame gym.

Original Post by octo-luv:

yesterday i decided that im going to listen to and learn from my inner brat. i think it only surfaces if i don't have enough balance in my life. i don't know, but im experiementing.

This makes a lot of sense.  I don't know whether the set point theory is true or anything, but I do know that anything lower than my current weight probably wouldn't work for me - if only because I know that I would have to cut back on eating even more.  I don't know if that makes me a little greedy-guts but it's really the way I think.  I've really had to work on finding that balance the last few weeks between working out and exercising enough to not go crazy while my knee heals up and resting it, and having to scale back on the calories.

Also, I've read in various places that even when people of so-called normal weight have been in calorie reduction "experiments/studies", they get really obsessed with food and eating and as soon as the study is done, they pig out.  It seems to be both psychological AND physiological. 

I totally believe in the set point theory.  It seems no matter what I do I stick to 110-115.  110 being the low end that I hit for a few days and 115 the high end that I hit for a few days.  I am normally 112-113.  Now I would love to see a number below 110, but in the last 8 months of working out pretty hard, haven't seen it even for 1 day.

When I start pigging out, I see 115.  I think my body likes 115, but I don't.... and the body refuses to go below 110.  I am going to make one last run for lower before I give up!

I like all or your comments.

Megan, I think I fall in with the study subjects - normal weight people who become obsessed with food when restricting.  I don't think I need to lose wieght, but I want to build muscle and lose fat - more of a body recomp thing.  I'm reading that you really can't do both at once, so I have been trying to lose fat first, then put on more muscle.  To lose fat, I have been cutting calories and I haven't been doing well with it.  I finally splurged and bought Leigh Peele's ebook - The Fat Loss Trouble Shoot.  She has a program called OPT remix, specially designed for body recomp.  I might give it a whorl when I finish Hyp I in NROL.  I'm very attached to NROL though, so don't know if I can give it up.  I've got about 8 more workouts in HYP I.  I'm running a small deficit again and if I don't make some progress, I think I will switch to Opt Remix.  It is a 12 week program.  By the way - how is the knee coming along? 

Octo, you are so right, balance is a big part of all this. 

Yoga, based on the pics you posted in your gallery, I don't think you need to go below 110.  I think body recomp is what you are after too - although, I don't even think you have much body fat to lose.  If I overstep my boundries, I apologize.  We all have our own ideas about how we want to look.  Leigh Peele has a website called avidityfitness.net. (it make change soon to leighpeele.com)   She has a series of podcasts on there that tell you what you need to concentrate on to achieve certain looks.  For the look I want, she says to eat more and pack on some muscle with heavy lifting.  But I am too vain to deal with the extra weight while I am bulking. 

Original Post by laura42:

Leigh Peele has a website called avidityfitness.net. (it make change soon to leighpeele.com)   She has a series of podcasts on there that tell you what you need to concentrate on to achieve certain looks.  For the look I want, she says to eat more and pack on some muscle with heavy lifting.  But I am too vain to deal with the extra weight while I am bulking. 

she had a very good podcast about what to do after a binge. its some where on her site.  anyway im off to do the intervals i didn't get a chance to do yesterday.

Thanks Laura...  I'd still like to lose some fat from the love handles and my upper arms, but it doesn't seem to be budging!

Octo - I listened to Leigh's podcast on how to achieve the "body-builder/fitness model look", but I can't get to the other "looks".    I know how to do the "skinny-fat" one she was talking about - just don't eat!  But - do you know what she recommends for the other one?

I agree with you as I too would have a hard time packing on the weight and being afraid it wouldn't come off when it was time to cut.    Maybe over winter! 

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

Thanks Laura...  I'd still like to lose some fat from the love handles and my upper arms, but it doesn't seem to be budging!

Octo - I listened to Leigh's podcast on how to achieve the "body-builder/fitness model look", but I can't get to the other "looks".    I know how to do the "skinny-fat" one she was talking about - just don't eat!  But - do you know what she recommends for the other one?

I agree with you as I too would have a hard time packing on the weight and being afraid it wouldn't come off when it was time to cut.    Maybe over winter! 

im not quite sure what you are asking about leigh's site, but i have a feeling that i don't know. ive only visited a few times.

i think winter is the best time. i'd probably pack on the pounds anyway, i hate winter here, why not do it for some more muscles.

Original Post by octo-luv:

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

Thanks Laura...  I'd still like to lose some fat from the love handles and my upper arms, but it doesn't seem to be budging!

Octo - I listened to Leigh's podcast on how to achieve the "body-builder/fitness model look", but I can't get to the other "looks".    I know how to do the "skinny-fat" one she was talking about - just don't eat!  But - do you know what she recommends for the other one?

I agree with you as I too would have a hard time packing on the weight and being afraid it wouldn't come off when it was time to cut.    Maybe over winter! 

im not quite sure what you are asking about leigh's site, but i have a feeling that i don't know. ive only visited a few times.

i think winter is the best time. i'd probably pack on the pounds anyway, i hate winter here, why not do it for some more muscles.

 Oh - sorry - it was Laura who said:

 "She has a series of podcasts on there that tell you what you need to concentrate on to achieve certain looks.  For the look I want, she says to eat more and pack on some muscle with heavy lifting.  But I am too vain to deal with the extra weight while I am bulking."

I guess the question should have been directed at her!

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

Original Post by octo-luv:

Original Post by yogagirl6853:

 Oh - sorry - it was Laura who said:

 "She has a series of podcasts on there that tell you what you need to concentrate on to achieve certain looks.  For the look I want, she says to eat more and pack on some muscle with heavy lifting.  But I am too vain to deal with the extra weight while I am bulking."

I guess the question should have been directed at her!

 I can't remember exactly because I honed in on the one I was interested in.  She talked about how to look like Paris Hilton - low cals, lots of coffee, high NEAT, not a lot of organized exercise, maybe some cardio.

Then she talked about how to look like Jessica Beale.  I tuned out on that one because she doesn't have the look I want.  She did say to avoid certain excercises if you don't want to build your traps, and other muscles that let people know.... yes, the woman lifts weights. 

Then she talked about how to get buff, and it involved more eating.  But I know I will just get fat with that strategy.  So, like I said, I think I am going to try Opt Remix after I finish Hyp I.  After what you said about 25 reps, I know I don't  want to do Hyp II.  Part of what helped me stay with this program so long is that I have been enjoying the workouts.  25 reps will be tedious, painful and boring, and will cause me to look for excuses not to go to the gym.

One last thing, I don't like complicated routines either.  That's what steared me away from the the NROL strength workouts.  I didn't want to be bothered with different weights and different number of reps and different tempos all in one workout for the same exercises.  I guess I have to say, I liked NROLFW better than NROL. 

ohhhh - the remix sounds great.  You will have to let us know how it goes.  Yeah - I am not sure about HYP II & the 25 reps.  HYP I is really LONG week-wise.  It has already been 3 times a week for 5 weeks for me and I am barely into the second half.

I agree that switching weight on the same exercise like is done in the strength is kind of a pain in the butt.  I don't like reloading the bar once I am set to go.  I haven't tried any strength yet either.  Just FL II and HYP I like you, I think.

Overall - I am finding NROL much harder and much less enjoyable than NROLFW.  The 4+ sets and pretty heavy exercises are a bit much.   I thought FLII was hard and hated the Bulg split squat with overhead press and was looking forward to HYP, but am finding it just as hard.  I am dreading my lower body days.  I definitely prefer full body... and more rest!!

Regarding the rests, I am reading that it is OK to take longer rests between sets.  The short rests can stress the body quite a bit and do not add that much to the overall effectiveness of the program.  I have to admit, that I never adhere to the 30 sec rest recommendation.  I am just not ready to go again after 30 sec.  And I find 90 sec too long to wait.  I usually just go again when I feel ready and that is usually 60 to 80 sec. Sometimes I even take a break between legs when doing split squats or stepups.  It is usually my grip that gives out before my legs, although I am quite spent after 15 reps on one side.

Good to hear... I start out with 30 sec rests on the first few exercises, but towards the end it gets to be more like 45 or sometimes 60.  Sometimes it takes that long just to set up for the next thing. 

Like for bench presses... I have the bench moved away from the rack so I can do the seated rows, then I have to move it back for the benches.  Then the seated rows and lat pulls are in the same workout, so I have to reload those too.  Also the high pulls - I actually use a different bar for that so I don't have to use the same weight and move my bench out of the way for each set.

Is anyone else in this stage of the game????  

I started this stage tonight.  Was pleasantly surprised that the weights I used when I ended it in 3 are now almost too easy- especially the barbell bent over row ,and the one armed raised squat.  Its great to know even though I don't feel stronger I must be though.

I am concentrating more on weight loss than anything else right now but noticed when doing the incline bench press I have some awesome arms just waiting to be shown to the world under this fat!!!

Sounds like you're making good progress! 

Hey Dbackerfan-

I'll be here in Stage 5 with you soon enough. Life keeps getting in the way of structured exercise for me lately! This reno is killer. Almost done tho- next week!!! Then things will get back to normal.

Gotta look good in a bathing suit on July 20-24th- vacation cottage at the beach!

workout b tonight and although I'm already feeling it I felt great while doing it.  I was able to deadlift bent over row 65 lbs- probably not great for lots of you but was better than when I ended stage 3 by 10 lbs and also feel I'll be able to do even more come my next time around this workout also did 5 lbs for the YTWL - was only able to do 3 lbs before.  Upped all the weights for all the routines so I know this is working.