Throwing Fuel on the Fire: Valerie Waters Red Carpet Ready, and Chad Waterbury's Sexy Female Training

I've been lurking here since July, and have been reading with interest the weight lifting vs. cardio threads. I myself have recently met my goal of losing 20 lbs and 4 sizes, by exercising with lifting heavy weights ala the Strumptuous/Rippetoe/NROL4W programs, with some light cardio thrown in.  I also roughly followed Tom Venuto's diet plan in Burn the Fat Feed the Muscle.  So I'm not a heavy weight hater.

However, in researching to see what goals to set next, I came across an interesting article with a cheesy title by Chad Waterbury called Sexy Female Training that does talk about the concept of female bulking:  http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/s ports_body_training_performance/sexy_female_t raining

I also read an interesting interview with him and Valerie Waters who is the trainer of Jessica Biel and Jennifer Garner as well as other celebrities.  Valerie Waters is the creator of an exercise plan called "Red Carpet Ready"  http://www.figureathlete.com/free_online_arti cle/bodybuilding/getting_the_red_carpet_look

Allywn Cosgrove, one of the authors of NROL and NROL4W says nice things about her on one of his blog posts. There are also positive reviews of this program by two reviewers who seem to have participated in heavy weight programs:

Sqwigg's review blog: http://skwigg.tripod.com/blog/index.blog/1802 334/red-carpet-ready/ 

Maggie Wang's blog: http://maggiewang.com/2008/11/06/red-carpet-r eady-6-week-results-and-review

I was wondering what people's thoughts were on this philosophy of female bulking, in light of these articles? 

I was also wondering if anyone here had tried the Red Carpet Ready plan, and would be willing to share their results or impressions? 

Chad trains lightweight MMA fighters in the 110-140lbs range. To him anything beyond that is 'heavyweight', leading to his very, very weird hangups about female muscle - while in theory his arguments sound plausible, they're only reasonable in practice if the body type you're optimizing for is Adriana Lima Masha Tyelna or any of the Hollywood Bobbleheads who are at least 10-15lbs underweight to look good on camera.

  And Valerie Waters likes to take credit for Jason Walsh's work, but she's not Jessica Biel's Trainer except for a very narrow window around the Oscars. You get that a lot in the fitness field - the ones with the name recognition get credit for other people's work.

  'course, she's also a pro and good at what she does, but what she does is help people maintain the underweight look that's fashionable in Hollywood at the moment, and I have a philosophical objection to anyone who makes a living from promoting body dysmorphic disorder - thanks to her work, women who look like women think that a natural level of muscularity and fitness is somehow unwomanly.

 Witness the reviewers in your link, who think that the Oxygen cover models have any muscle whatsoever.

Interesting. It just makes me even more confused.

...I certainly wouldn't mind looking like Adriana Lima.

Original Post by jblarghp:

Interesting. It just makes me even more confused.

...I certainly wouldn't mind looking like Adriana Lima.

 

uh im not sure about those models in victoria secrets, they have no waists. the only model's body that i've ever liked really is christie_brinkley. i know it depends on what 'look' she is going for (she has some pics looking very slim, some others looking rather defined), but as a fitness model she was pretty good & usually looked healthy.

Blargh, it is confusing to me too.  There is so much contradicting information out there, and its hard to tell the good information from the bad. 

Some swear by hours cardio, others by weight lifting, others by eating a particular diet, etc.  Whatever the method, everyone swears their way is the best whether you are seeking advise on a message board like this one, or researching what diet/exercise book to buy.

Even the useful information is confusing.  For example, someone new to exercise and weight loss might be encouraged to lose fat by lifting heavy weights in order to gain muscle and to eat with a daily calorie deficit. At the same time we get told that an individual can't build muscle without eating a caloric surplus.  It doesn't make sense, until you eventually find out that newbie lifters can build muscle/lose fat at the same time for an initial period, and that it is possible to maintain your existing muscle while in a deficit, and that body builders alternate surplus/deficit cycles to attain particular goals.

Compound weight lifting exercises like a squat or deadlift are more efficient than an isolated exercise like a hamstring curl.  However if you do these with bad form, then you risk injuring yourself.  You could snicker on this forum about the woman you saw in the gym lifting barbie weights, but on a different forum someone might be simultaneously mocking you because you did a 3/4 squat instead of the perfectly parallel one you think you did. I'm not saying that a woman shouldn't try to squat because of this, but I can see why someone would be intimidated.

And um, all this being said, has anyone tried Red Carpet Ready? 

Melkor, thank you so much for responding. You mentioned body dysmorphic disorder above.  I think so much of this is caused by the different extremes of different ideal body archetypes that we see in our everyday media.  I think that we relate to these extremes even though it is unlikely we will reach these ideals.  What might be ideal to one person is different than what is ideal to another.

For example, serious powerlifters usually have both a lot of muscle with bodyfat.  Famous body builders have freakishly defined muscles and freakishly low bodyfat.  Famous marathoners usually have low muscles and bodyfat, and are kind of stringy looking to me.  Being a famous actresses/model is different than being a trained athlete, but it is safe to say many of them are very thin with little muscle or bodyfat.

Women are told not to fear "bulking", because it is hard to build muscle and because we lack testosterone.  However one might also come to the conclusion that if a women trains and eats for long enough like a powerlifter or a body builder then yes, eventually she will look like one, i.e. be "bulky".  If you train and eat like a marathoner for long enough then perhaps she will eventually look like one.  The model/actress is trickier because there isn't really a specific training program - my very uneducated guess is that models are thin due to strict diet/cardio and beautiful due to genetics.  But I think it is safe to say that someone would think that if they trained like a particular model or actress then it is possible to eventually look like one. 

Because of this, it is easy to see why women might shy away from weight training, because the extreme of the actress's physique is more appealing than the extreme of powerlifter physique. It doesn't matter that it is very unlikely that the average women will ever look a professional powerlifter/powerlifter if they weight trained.  Personally, if I did get bulky, it STILL would be an improvement over how I was before.  (I personally was 32% fat to start, am 25% fat now, and I'd like to get to 22% I think)

Wow, I just left two really long posts, I guess I just have to get stuff off my chest. : p

Copying this over from another thread that helped me clarify my thinking a bit:  Actually, it wasn't Adriana Lima or Gisele I was thinking of, it would be more along the lines of Masha Tyelna- if you want to look like Gisele or Lima, you'd be better off to actually train like them:

 Joe Dowdell, owner of Peak Performance in NYC, trains many of the top female models in the city and their programming includes squats, deadlifts, chin-ups, bench variations, sled dragging, and tons of energy system work. Yes, Victoria's Secret models are doing squats and deadlifts.

4 Things Your Girlfriend Should Know
by Tony Gentilcore, CSCS, CPT

 Sorry about that mixup - nothing wrong with Mrs. Lima or her training regime, she looks like she knows which end of a barbell to pull. And I defy anyone to look at little 97lbs Suzanna who's about 50% stronger than me pound for pound and call her bulky, even if Chad Waterbury thinks you shouldn't train like her ;)

Original Post by melkor:

4 Things Your Girlfriend Should Know
by Tony Gentilcore, CSCS, CPT 

meh, they still have no waists! lima gets away with a little bit more because she has t's & a's for her size (more t than a), which is more genetics if you ask me.

and i can't stand that gentilcore article, im just not sure if it's an effective article on getting the point across. its an article written to just agree with some of us who are completely gung ho about lifting. its just a little too filled with ridicule to really help. & you know im all about lifting, but i think the main point should be to get people to actually 'hear' the message & not put them off of it with a bit of snottiness.

sorry for the rant, its in no way directed at you melkor (pls forgive) & i know you didn't write it, but i just can't stand his attitude.

It seems that all the Figure Athlete and T-Nation articles are written that way (snarky and tongue-in-cheek with a lifter bias), so I just ignored it.

I liked the Gentilcore article, especially the Yoga information, which has given me food for thought.

Original Post by melkor:

Copying this over from another thread that helped me clarify my thinking a bit:  Actually, it wasn't Adriana Lima or Gisele I was thinking of, it would be more along the lines of Masha Tyelna- if you want to look like Gisele or Lima, you'd be better off to actually train like them:

 Joe Dowdell, owner of Peak Performance in NYC, trains many of the top female models in the city and their programming includes squats, deadlifts, chin-ups, bench variations, sled dragging, and tons of energy system work. Yes, Victoria's Secret models are doing squats and deadlifts.

4 Things Your Girlfriend Should Know
by Tony Gentilcore, CSCS, CPT

 Sorry about that mixup - nothing wrong with Mrs. Lima or her training regime, she looks like she knows which end of a barbell to pull. And I defy anyone to look at little 97lbs Suzanna who's about 50% stronger than me pound for pound and call her bulky, even if Chad Waterbury thinks you shouldn't train like her ;)

 So I guess tons of Cardio training is ok as long as you call it something else.

Edit: Sorry, off topic.

Argh.

 No-one in their right mind has ever said "don't do cardio", it's "don't do excessive cardio", but energy systems work is wider than your bog-standard low-grade, low-intensity repetitive motion cardio of your average cardio bunny walking or running on a treadmill for hours, with the attendant overemphasis of the aerobic and neglect of the anaerobic cellular energy systems.

Where the "cardio-bunny" style of spending hours on an elliptical trainer itself seems like a bastardization of a perfectly valid training technique for distance running and cycling. If you want to be able to cycle or run distances that an untrained, sedentary person can't, say cycle 50-100 miles, or run 6-26 miles, you need to spend some of your time practicing going a longer distance at a slower speed.

Long slow distance is a useful training technique that gets (IMO) overused in some endurance training protocols, and misused for general fitness purposes.

Oh, wow. That Suzanna is incredible.

I have the red carpet ready system and it has nothing to do with maintaining an underweight body I love Val and her workout. I came across her workout when I was looking for a great workout to whip my butt in to shape.  As someone who has tried it I love it. I am 5 3 and have a short torso. My legs also can get muscular when I work them out too much. This program is great because Valarie's workouts tighten and tone without bulking. She is known for creating a tight uplifted booty. Someone said she took credit for Jessical Biels body which she does not. Film execs call her in to work with actresses for movies tv shows etc. She was called in for the illusionist.  Valarie was called in to keep her fit but trim her down because she had just finished blade and needed to look a little more feminine for the role. Jennifer Garner is has been her client for 8 years and is rock hard. Yes she is thin but she is naturally thin. I am a member of the red carpet ready club on line and there is no women that are too thin. Ages range from 20 to 60. And her workouts are hard.  She doesn't have an eating plan just a guide on what food to eat. It is just an eating clean diet. I am someone who is not too thin and can gain muscle easily these workouts are perfect for me. This program might not be for everyone and Valarie lets you know that.  Valarie works for your body. And she lets you know that all her celebrity clients work hard for their body.  And from experience working with many different workouts and trainers you CAN get too bulky as a female. And maybe you like that look but I don't and again I am so far from being too skinny. And Valarie waters plan is all about strength training it is just from using 8 to 10 pound weights and the right exercises to tone all over and gives an amazing uplifted butt for your body type. I think that this is a great workout if you are not a body lifter. I am not a paid endorser and I don't usually write reviews. But I needed to say something as someone that has tried it and loves it!