Urban Myth Debunked: 8 glasses of water a day will help with weight loss

So, I have lately been reading studies that say the necessity of  drinking 8 glasses of water a day is essentialy an urban myth.

http://www.webmd.com/diet/guide/wonders-of-wa ter

Quote: "A 2002 study published in the American Journal of Physiology questioned the old recommendation of 8 ounces of water, eight times a day. After a thorough review, researcher Heinz Valtin concluded there was inadequate evidence that healthy adults -- living in temperate climates and not engaged in rigorous activities -- need large amounts of water.
For normal, healthy adults, Valtin recommended simply drinking when thirsty. And he reported that even caffeinated drinks can count toward satisfying our fluid requirements.
In February 2004, the Institute of Medicine (IOM) issued new recommendations that agree with Valtin's findings. The new guidelines remove the eight-glasses-a-day recommendation, and say healthy adults may use thirst to determine their fluid needs. Exceptions to this rule include anyone with a medical condition requiring fluid control; athletes; and people taking part in prolonged physical activities or whose living conditions are extreme. "

And: http://www.webmd.com/news/20080402/h...water- oversold

Quote: "April 2, 2008 -- The health benefits of drinking water, at least for already healthy people, may have been oversold, according to a new report. The findings will likely disappoint water-bottle-toting Americans and relieve those who can never seem to down those eight glasses of water a day, widely recommended for our health.
But there is nothing magical about those eight glasses, at least when it comes to proven health benefits, according to a new report. "There is no clear evidence of benefit from drinking increased amounts of water," writes Stanley Goldfarb, MD, professor of medicine at the University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, and the senior author of an editorial on the topic in the Journal of the AmericanSociety of Nephrology."

Also:

Quote: "Turns out, there is no single study and no single outcome that led to the recommendation becoming popular, he says. Somehow, it took on a life of its own.
Goldfarb and his University of Pennsylvania colleague, Dan Negoianu, MD, next examined some popular claims about the health benefits of drinking water, trying in each case to find scientific evidence.
"We looked at the evidence of some of the so-called urban myths that have grown up about drinking water," Goldfarb says. "

I find that very interesting. Okay, promise my last quote here, and perhaps the most relevant to weight loss:

Quote: "The most surprising finding, he says, was the lack of a scientific link found between drinking a lot of water in order to eat less. "I thought [the suggestion that] filling up your stomach with water might help lose weight makes sense," he says. "

 

I agree. No need to count oz or glasses of water. And a "temperate climate" what temperature & humidity is that and how many people live there?! However, IMO drinking lots of water does 2 things. 1) helps regulate the sodium levels to prevent water retention and 2) gives me more exercise in getting rid of it. Over the years for intense exercise, I considered myself well hydrated if I could go to the bathroom before and after a workout.  When that happened I never had a problem with dehydration during the workout.

In short, I'd like to see statistics/recommendations that we take in water at a rate that yields a certain elimination outcome. 

That thing about regulating the sodium levels is also an urban myth. If you link to my second link on the second page, you'll see this:

quote: In other research, increased water intake was found to affect the clearance of many substances by the kidneys, including sodium. But the studies don't prove any sort of clinical benefit, Goldfarb says.

"What almost certainly happens is, any toxins the kidney is responsible for excreting simply get diluted when the person is drinking a lot of water," Goldfarb says.

Original Post by javagen3:

quote: In other research, increased water intake was found to affect the clearance of many substances by the kidneys, including sodium. But the studies don't prove any sort of clinical benefit, Goldfarb says.

 Does show clearance of sodium... but what clinical benefit?

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2003/02/ 030205073358.htm from Wake Forest Univ Bapt Med Ctr, "It is hard to distinguish between being thirsty and being hungry, so try drinking water and waiting 20 to 30 minutes to see if you're still hungry."   ... Water is an important nutrient and is vital for a variety of bodily functions and processes including removal of waste products, carrying nutrients, and regulating body temperature," she said. "Water helps reduce fluid retention, and helps keep bowel functions normal."   but then calculates the water needs by "weight in pounds and divide by two."

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerende r.fcgi?artid=22177 scientific article of research on quail analysing different tissues showed that the drinking water vs water found in other nutrition affects metabolic process in various tissues. The purpose was not to relate to humans but to be able to reconstruct a diet based on tissue findings. So my take is there is a clinical affect, but how it relates to me I don't know---

http://www.weightloss-research.com/diet-myths -debunked.html

"Drinking a certain quantity of water every day is a good idea because it keeps the body hydrated and fills the stomach. Water also keeps the intestines healthy by facilitating the movements of undigested food to the exit point. However, simply drinking water does not trigger weight loss. There is only one way to lose weight and that is to burn up the existing fat and water cannot do that. Nor should a diet be judged solely by how much weight is lost per week. Some people claim that a diet can be considered effective if the weekly loss of weight is above two pounds. Frankly, two pounds per week is a lot of weight to lose and you can be sure that not all of it is fat, but also the lean tissue that makes up the muscles. "

http://health.nytimes.com/health/guides/nutri tion/water-in-diet/overview.html Disappointing although dated Aug 3, 2008 repeats the standard lines including "Six to eight 8-ounce glasses of water are generally recommended on a daily basis." I also found numerous sites making statements about "diet water" and those promoting water or a diet plan. I skipped those.  In summary: I think Goldfarb overstated the clinical benefit unless he stating a specific like "it will make you lose weight." I don't see evidence of others backing away from the recommended amounts of water and I don't see them relating it to any body function except thirst.  

Doesn't drinking water dilute stomach acid?  Water seems give some relief when I have almost any stomach ailment. 

Don't know. I used to drink very little water mainly because I hate the way it tastes in US, even the bottled water is yucky. So I used to drink about 8 oz of other caffeinated drinks, coke, coffee, tea. Never felt thirsty, had no craving for water and did not sweat at all.

Then I had to have some blood tests...and well, the embarrassing part is-they could not get blood out of my veins! After being pricked with needles for 2! hours in different parts of my body, the nurse gave up. I got home looking like a drug addict, band aids all over and figured I had no choice but to start the 8x8 routine.

First 3 days I had to force myself to drink it, felt horrible and sick. But the fourth day I actually felt thirsty enough to drink 64oz.  Right now I drink anywhere from 50 to 80 oz  a day. And that's because I am actually thirsty.

So I guess thirst really depends on what intake of fluids your body is used to. Oh, and they were finally able to take blood for the tests, this time no pricking and no forced pumping.

I more or less drink when thirsty but always feel that I do not have get enough (probably because of these myths).  I do know that going strictly by thirst might not be enough (at least for me), for example not drinking enough (20 ounces or less per day) gives me a lot of muscle cramps when working out. 

It's interesting how these things get to be so widespread and considered common knowledge to the point they are rarely questioned. I think its always good to question stuff like this.

Original Post by alibombali:

Doesn't drinking water dilute stomach acid?  Water seems give some relief when I have almost any stomach ailment. 

 It seems that water does serve a diluting function.

Original Post by javagen3:

It's interesting how these things get to be so widespread and considered common knowledge to the point they are rarely questioned. I think its always good to question stuff like this.

And will be subsequently unbunked by future study, to be redebunked by the next...

The problem is the only real answer is "what works for you." The problem with that answer is that it's very hard to experiment on yourself.

Also, I think that pushing water for health is a good thing, if only because it's in a position of being sounder than the alternatives. You don't have to worry about any of the other sorts of calories or chemical substitutes, only what might happen to be floating around your municipal water supply.

Lol, I guess one the things to keep in mind is that "feeling better" isn't a clinical or medical outcome!  I feel better when I drink a lot of water.... that doesn't mean its necessarily doing me good! I feel better when I drink alcohol too!

But more seriously, although my body probably functions very effectively on the amount of water I get from my food, milk and fruit juice, my very dry skin visibly gets less dry when I drink a lot of water regularly. And my hair gets shinier, etc etc, but these aren't necessarily the kind of health benefits that you can measure in a study, and the amount of water that has this effect on me isn't the same as the amount that would have that effect on someone else. I guess its more a question of drinking enough water to not be dehydrated, so for some people just when they are thirsty, for other people counting the glasses is probably more effective.

Original Post by javagen3:

It's interesting how these things get to be so widespread and considered common knowledge to the point they are rarely questioned. I think its always good to question stuff like this.

Well, it's comman knowledge that whenever anyone says somethign is comman knowledge, they will have absolutly no way to back it up :P

Anyway, I don't think encouraging people to drink water is all bad, after all, it's a lot harder to drink too much than too little, but a hard and fast rule of 64 oz? I tend to be skeptical of that.

Hmmmm!  In my personal experience I have found water to be an important part of my fitness program.  Water helps keep me from feeling hungry, helps wash away the waste from burned fat, and keeps my joints well lubed. 

Now I don't count how many ounces I drink, but it is probably between 4 and 6 liters a day.  And since I have been very successful in my program, down some 300 pounds, I'll keep drinking my water!!

Original Post by duke3522:

Hmmmm!  In my personal experience I have found water to be an important part of my fitness program.  Water helps keep me from feeling hungry, helps wash away the waste from burned fat, and keeps my joints well lubed. 

Yeah, me too. And regardless of what studies say (I bet there'll be a contradictory one next week.) it helped me lose weight the last time, and I bet it will do it again!

Original Post by smartjock256:

Original Post by javagen3:

It's interesting how these things get to be so widespread and considered common knowledge to the point they are rarely questioned. I think its always good to question stuff like this.

Well, it's comman knowledge that whenever anyone says somethign is comman knowledge, they will have absolutly no way to back it up :P

Anyway, I don't think encouraging people to drink water is all bad, after all, it's a lot harder to drink too much than too little, but a hard and fast rule of 64 oz? I tend to be skeptical of that.

Ha! You're right about that common knowledge deal. I agree its not a bad thing to encourage people to drink water instead of soda, for example-- but I'd leave the myth part out of it. There have been a few cases of drowning by folks drinking too much water. 

 

Original Post by duke3522:

Hmmmm!  In my personal experience I have found water to be an important part of my fitness program.  Water helps keep me from feeling hungry, helps wash away the waste from burned fat, and keeps my joints well lubed. 

Okay -- now you don't actually know it does those things! I doubt you test your urine for burned fat particles. You just assume it does. But, I'm not saying water in general is bad for you, I'm just saying there's a ton of things people say about it that just are not true-- or rather, not supportable.

i think water is essential for just being healthy. if you're dieting, exercising or just living you need to make sure you're drinking enough water. i live in the desert and dehydration is something that happens all the time, even when you don't realize it. it can be very dangerous and catch you off guard.

with my active lifestyle i drink about a gallon of water a day- all year round . in fact, i just got back from vacation, where water wasn't readily available, and i totally noticed it in my energy level and just how my body "felt". based on my experiece, i would say that this is not an urban myth- picking up a hitchiker that turns out to be a dead person, maybe...but definitely not drinking water

I think there are several issues being discusses as one. 

1) the myth of "8 8oz glasses" is a myth only because it's misunderstood and misinterpreted.  64 oz of fluid is the recommended amount and it's a general number, not exact for each person. 

2)the myth of drinking water for weight loss is an exaggerated suggestion.  Oftentimes thirst feels like hunger and instead of drinking something, we eat something.  Thus, we don't quench our thirst and we've likely eaten something we didn't need.  The suggestion to drink water first is to test our hunger, not satiate it.  This doesn't even cover the mindless high-carb drinking we do instead of drinking water when we are thirsty.  I speak from experience.

I live in an extreme climate and need to drink a lot of water.  I have had a caffeine addiction and it's hard to keep caffeine withdrawal distinguished from dehydration.  Not to mention that caffeine dehydrates you and if you're too stupid, you'll drink more caffeine instead of water to get rid of the ill effects of either condition!

Original Post by freedomfrom:

Original Post by javagen3:

It's interesting how these things get to be so widespread and considered common knowledge to the point they are rarely questioned. I think its always good to question stuff like this.

And will be subsequently unbunked by future study, to be redebunked by the next...

The problem is the only real answer is "what works for you." The problem with that answer is that it's very hard to experiment on yourself.

Also, I think that pushing water for health is a good thing, if only because it's in a position of being sounder than the alternatives. You don't have to worry about any of the other sorts of calories or chemical substitutes, only what might happen to be floating around your municipal water supply.

 I general your municipal water supply is more rigorously tested and monitored than any bottled water.

Of course, I'm on well water and there's no way I'm drinking that garbage.

Confusing thirst with hunger.... I'm not saying this isn't possible at all, but it isn't possible with me. Thirst and hunger feel entirely different to me. So it always strikes me as strange to hear people talk about eating when they are really thirsty. But again, that could be because I've never been one to overeat and have been pretty in tune with my body for a long time.

I drink water with my meals. I also drink when working out. And I drink when I feel thirsty. That's it. But that's also all I drink: just water. It seems to do the trick. I don't worry about getting a certain amount into my body. When I tried that, several times, for months on end, I spent my life in the bathroom. That pretty much told me I didn't need that much water. Even during a multi-hour workout it's rare for me to drink more than one glass of water, though I do sometimes need two. And I live in the second driest state in the nation.

One of the biggest, most obvious health benefit not mentioned is that water has zero calories.  I understand that there are diet drinks out there, but the true all-natural zero calorie drink is...WATER.

I was drinking 2-3 cans of coke per day, resulting in 300-450 calories a day in just that alone.  I can't stand diet drinks, and I'm not so sure they are good for me anyway, and even if it's true that water has no other health benefits, at least it's a neutral alternative to chemically-formulated drinks.